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To: kech who wrote (102572)	2/28/2005 11:58:22 AM
From: DavesM	Respond to of 793917

Tom, Sorry, I'm not disagreeing with you either. It is merely frustration regarding this subject. In general, colleges are the most liberal/progressive slice of the American landscape. The idea that colleges would break the law and discriminate against women, well if it happens, I think it is very very rare. They simply cannot (or don't want to) compete with private industry for American Engineers. Engineers are usually very practical people. I've read that about a quarter of engineering undergraduates are now women. A career in Academics means that an engineer would have to set aside a good income, and study at least another 3 years, then get a post-doc position that has a monthly salary that is lower - than the salary than he would get as a summer (undergraduate) intern, hoping for a Assistant Professorship that pays roughly the same as a starting salary as entry level engineering school graduate. How is any of this sexist? A few days ago I wrote (at this site), that complaining that there aren't enough phd's in engineering at American Universities, is actually a complaint about the number of women graduating from Chinese and Korean Engineering Schools. I also pointed out, that almost half of Medical and Dental School students (future Doctors) are women.

To: kech who wrote (102572)	3/1/2005 1:13:54 PM
From: Mary Cluney	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 793917

Certainly one would do different things to raise the proportion of domestic students (and therefore a higher proportion of women) than one would do if one thought the problem was discrimination against women within the domestic educational institutions. There is no doubt there are fewer women in academia than men. Women have made tremendous progress in the last 35 years. All the variables that make up the difference should be put on the table. It would be irresponsible not to be able tod discuss certain issues for fear of hurting people's feelings. But, at the Dr. Summers level, the discussion has to be intelligent. Nobody gets a pass. We do not want to shut up Dr. Summers. We want him to talk about his remarks. And, on the other side, we hope that Dr. Summers does not cave in to irresponsible demands that he shut up. We want him to defend his position - why he raised certain questions. Nobody should get a pass - on either side. In the early 1970's, women received less than 10 percent of all graduate degrees in law, medicine, dentistry and veterinary medicine. They were below 20 percent in pharmacy. .... today women earn about two-thirds of the degrees in veterinary medicine and pharmacy. They're approaching 50 percent in law, and they've topped 40 percent in medicine. More than a third of new dentists are women. Likewise, women's share of master's degrees from business schools rose from 3.6 percent in 1970 to 41.1 percent in 2002.