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To: shades who wrote (28669)	3/25/2005 5:15:43 AM
From: zonder	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 306849

I take issue with your statement that if the husband changed his mind and did not want them, he would get them anyway Yeah, well, you can take whatever you want, but unless you know a way to join our family, emotionally & legally, your "taking issue" on what might go on between me and my husband is completely irrelevant. What if it was the reverse - he wanted them and you agreed at the start you did too - but then you changed your mind? That is what divorce is for. You want me to feel sorry for men because they can't give birth to their own spring and need us women for it? this man of "GOD" and life convinced his daughter to have an abortion and kill my child and I had no say in the matter. She wanted to still get married "after" she worked things out with religious nut daddy And you were surprised that a family of religious nuts did not want a child out of wedlock??? so what is required to convince women like my ex fiance not to murder children once already impregnated Nothing short of locking them up in dungeon, both arms and legs tied to the wall, for the whole duration of the pregnancy. If a woman does not want to be a mother at that point in her life, or ever, there is nothing else in the world that will make her carry a child to term. You should have a system of adoption in place afterwards, because keeping her chained in the dungeon for her entire life so that she also unwillingly suffers the joys of motherhood might not be practical. If abortion is illegal in one country, a woman will cross borders. If she can't, she will find a back-alley room in which to have it aborted by a witch doctor, in an unsanitized environment. If even that is unavailable, she will poke her insides with a stick, drink rat poison, or risk her life in other ways to get rid of that little bit of flesh that is hijacking her body and her life. At the end of the day, the question boils down to whether or not you want women to end their unwanted pregnancy in sanitary conditions & at the hands of qualified doctors, or risk their lives in the process. Personal attacks do not solve the problem I have not attacked your person, and there is no problem except possibly a personal one (yours) at an emotional level, because you have not had children and you would have wanted to. As for "lower fertility means our nation and culture are dying!", I can't take that seriously, as the nation in question is a place that prides itself on being a melting pot of nationalities, cultures, and ethnic backgrounds. What is "American" if not a way of life and collection of ideals? So what if you need more immigrants to sustain stable population in the US? The world has too much aggregate population growth already, and if in some parts population stagnates or decreases, that sounds like a good thing to me.