Silicon Investor (SI) -- The First Internet Community

STOCKTALK

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor. We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community. If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.

Strategies & Market Trends : Booms, Busts, and Recoveries -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: y2kate who wrote (65729)	6/30/2005 4:15:41 PM
From: energyplay	Respond to of 74559

I would actually like an informed discussion on the 'fair trade' issue, many people on this thread have actual, ground based data on the reality vs. the P.R. chaff. BTW, this is where Bono seems to have done a better job than Bob Geldof - appears Bono has few illusions about the corruption part of the equation **** Child labor is one of the strongest arguments from the 'fair trade' side. Getting to you question of child labor, what are the real (as opposed to theoretical) options besides factory work ? The gut reactions of most Westerners is she should be in school. Many places don't have schools, because their government doesn't have the money or prefers to have it consumed by the elite. The other economic alternatives will be working with the family, possibly on a farm. But many poor families don't have farms or a place use non adults, often because of the physical requiremnets (such as fishing) There a number of secondary issues, such a dangerous work practices, non-payment of wages, etc. But assuming that the child labor is not specifically used as a way to avoid employing adults, and there are no alternate places, such as schools, then child labor may be the best of a poor set of options. >>>What does the 'fair trade' side propose as realistic alternatives ? I don't mean to stick you with having to defend all the 'fair trade' positons. *** Child labor existed in the US for long time. Children were in coal mines until the 1890s Childern were extensively used on farms until the 1950s, and I mean young kids, not a 15 year old driving a combine in Kansas for a few weeks.

To: y2kate who wrote (65729)	6/30/2005 8:42:16 PM
From: Slagle	Respond to of 74559

y2kate Re: "free trade" Worse that the sweat shop aspect is the fact that the vast majority of the nations in the world and the people who live there are just left out in the cold. And we haven't even seen the worst of it yet. The implementation of the "Uruguay Round" tariff reduction programs were dictated to the various signatory nations on a schedule to be phased in over a 15 to even 20 year period. The greater part of it hasn't even begun to bite yet as most of the signatory nations have been stalling and dragging their feet. Take a small country like the Philippines, though this could apply to a hundred others. At the signing of the Uruguay agreement back in the early 1990's the Philippines had a 50% protective tariff on imported shoes in place to protect their domestic footware industry and the income of the thousands of workers. The Uruguay agreement laid out a schedule to reduce the import tariff to zero, but over a twenty year period. All the econ gobbeldey-gook (and some fantastic kickbacks) about the "most efficient producer" theory were offered to the Filipino signatories. And I guess they figured they would be dead and gone when the xxxx hit the fan anyway. By now shoe import tariffs are probably down to 25% (this is just a guess, though I could look it up) and the Philippine shoe industry is dying like our textile industry, but still employs a large number of folks in jobs that are considered precious in a place like that. When the industry finally dies, what will those people do? In the Philippines there is NO social safety net. This dastardly scheme was sold to the Filipinos and others back in 1990 on the basis that losses in one area would be more than offset by benefits in other areas. I can tell you from what I have seen with my own eyes that this has been proven to be a total lie. There are NO benefits. And the very devil himself could not have designed a scheme more wasteful and destructive of the worlds natural resources. Think of all the energy wasted to ship bulky stuffed toys and heavy cement halfway around the world and THEN RETURN THE SHIPS EMPTY because there is no backhaul. The only electorate in the world that actually has a voice in this lives right here in the USA. Isn't it curious that so far, at least, we are still not suffering much privation. It has to be that way, for when the pain begins here we will demand protectionism and we will get it. I think before long this "unlimited global free trade" insanity will collapse due to its many contradictions. It should be ended, and it will be. Slagle