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Politics : GOPwinger Lies/Distortions/Omissions/Perversions of Truth -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: longnshort who wrote (52509)	7/13/2005 4:42:20 PM
From: American Spirit	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 173976

Rove lied and obstructed justice, plus he probably committed perjury and treason. The special prosecutor is deciding on that. His excuse that "Wilson's wife" isn't "naming" her is outrageous. Shows how dishonest Rove is. If Rove were innocent, why didn't he step up two years ago and explain? Rove is probably the most crooked devious political operator in US history. He is not to believed on any level. Just look at his record. What this is really all about though is that Bush lied about the nuclear program and sent us to war on false pretenses. That's impeachable.

To: longnshort who wrote (52509)	7/13/2005 5:33:29 PM
From: bentway	Respond to of 173976

Tom Tomorrow Fox News Watch huffingtonpost.com Ever since Arianna invited me to join the ranks of her esteemed contributors, I've been intending to write a suitably impressive introductory post--you know, uncompromising and angry, but in a wry sort of way, with maybe just a hint of poignancy. But I think I'll dispense with all of that and get right down to business. One of the stupidest talking points I've seen so far in the Rove/Plame matter is the attempt to conflate the exposure of Valerie Plame's status as a CIA operative with any pre-Novak acknowledgment of her existence. John Gibson tried this one out on Bob Beckel a couple of nights ago (my transcript, so no link): Were you ever in any of those receiving lines where Joe Wilson brought his CIA operative wife out into public view in front of cameras to meet the president and such? If he brings her out in public to be photographed by tv, hasn't he outed her? Well, no, John, he hasn't, not unless he also hung a big "CIA AGENT" sign around her neck. As my friend Billmon notes: In Gibson's imagination, cameras apparently possess some kind of powerful magic that allows America's enemies (other than Karl Rove, I mean) to identify undercover CIA agents simply by looking at their pictures. Does the Man from U.N.C.L.E. know about this? Gibson was at it again last night, this time with regular Fox News contributor Judge Andrew Napolitano, and this time--I know this will be difficult to believe--demonstrable falsehoods were uttered. Right there, on the Network America Trusts. Sayeth Judge Napolitano (again, my transcript): ...then I would ask, was her name already out there? Our friend and colleague at the New York Post, owned by the same parent company as Fox News, the wonderful John Podheretz reports this morning that her name was out there--where?--on her husband's own website! He revealed to the world, before the Novak article, that his wife worked for the CIA. So my second question is, did Karl Rove tell these people something they didn't already know? The problem with this statement is that it is, well, not the least little bit true. Here's what the Pod actually wrote in the Post (registration required): But Plame's undercover status at the time was and is a little questionable in any case. How undercover could she have been when her name was published at the time as part of Joseph Wilson's own biography online? (Incidentally, here's the entirety of what Wilson's bio, at the URL provided by Podheretz, says about his wife: "He is married to the former Valerie Plame and has two sons and two daughters." Admittedly, it could have been edited--maybe in an earlier version it said, "He is married to a Super Duper Secret Agent named Valerie Plame who works on very important Top Secret Stuff, so don't tell anyone!" But somehow I doubt it.) Now, the careful reader will note that that Podheretz does not accuse Wilson of outing his own wife as a CIA agent--only of acknowledging the fact that she is his wife. And I don't actually believe that these people are so impenetrably stupid that they are unable to comprehend that simple distinction. This is just the standard right wing debate tactic that we've seen over and over again over the past few years: throw out a ton of nonsense and see what sticks. But you can take it to the bank: in Wingnutland, it will be--if it is not already--taken as gospel truth that Joe Wilson used to run a website called "www.my-wife-is-a-big-old-CIA-agent.com". (A version of the preceding was also posted at my own site.) Posted at 10:42 AM

To: longnshort who wrote (52509)	7/13/2005 11:59:49 PM
From: Doug R	Respond to of 173976

bongnsnort, what drugs are you on now? RAY MCGOVERN: Well, that she is a covert operative under deep cover is clear from the official correspondence between the CIA and the Justice Department and the White House. That she was working on a sensitive area speaks for itself. We know from the original Novak column that she was working on weapons of mass destruction, and what could be more sensitive than that. And so whoever leaked this did so with blithe disregard to the national security implications of this or the implications of the safety and physical wellbeing of not only this woman, but all the informants and agents she had recruited over the years. JOHN SHOVELAN: Could you tell us a little bit about what kind of network she would have had to establish? RAY MCGOVERN: She was operating, as what the Soviets used to always call, “an illegal,” okay? So she enjoyed no protection of an official passport or a diplomatic passport or anything like that. She was very, really and truly a spy. If she were wrapped up, she'd end up in jail, she doesn’t end up in the embassy. So she because of this non-official cover, because she has no ostensible connections with the US Government, she was able to recruit agents who wouldn't go near a US embassy with a 10-foot pole, and so those are the kinds of people you need to report on sensitive areas like what kinds of weapons of mass destruction and materials might be shipped to Iraq or Iran, Syria or North Korea. JOHN SHOVELAN: I guess it’d be a fair assumption to suggest that the CIA would be looking at how her contacts have been compromised since her name was published? RAY MCGOVERN: Yes, this damage assessment was begun immediately, it will take some time to do of course. What normally happens is people just disappear into the woodwork and often we don't know if they're hanging from a lamp post in Syria, or whether they've just gone, fled to a different country. JOHN SHOVELAN: At the moment, there's been some suggestions it was no great secret that Mrs Plame that she worked for the CIA. What's your response to that? RAY MCGOVERN: That’s been… we're so accustomed to spin in this capital that I could have written that line myself. What happened was… incredibly ironic, because it was a day after the House Intelligence Committee criticised the CIA vigorously for lacking human source information on areas like weapons of mass destruction. And here, the next day, the crime report is issued and indicates that senior White House officials have blown the cover of someone who is working precisely in this area, and there couldn't be more than a handful of such offices handling agents in this area so this has implications for our national security. abc.net.au Violation of the Espionage Act carries the death penalty.