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Politics : Don't Blame Me, I Voted For Kerry -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: ChinuSFO who wrote (64295)	7/20/2005 1:31:02 PM
From: Dan B.	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 81568

Re: "If you support Bush and his decision to go to war in Iraq then you care more for Iraqi lives than the American lives that were lost in the WTC." While all lives are important, I'll not quibble with your insinuation that I should put Americans, i.e. my own kind, ahead of others. However, there is no connection between my support for the Iraq War, and your mistaken belief that I must therefore value Iraqis over Americans. I likely wouldn't support the Iraq War if I didn't believe it protects Americans, so your conclusion above is of course dead wrong. I believe the President has proven himself quite serious in the war on terrorism. You seem to think if Terrorists can attack as in London, it means we are losing the war on terror. In reality, neither you nor I can envision how to have totally shut terrorism down by now, if perhaps we could if over the course of the coming decades. Perhaps you are more hawkish than I, but I wouldn't have thought so given your stance on Iraq. Perhaps to prevent terrorism and win, you'd like to nuke some chosen places around the world, including buildings & homes where merely suspicious people live. That might nearly shut terrorism down. We could bomb mosques in Saudi Arabia and elsewhere, for instance. Oh, what we could do. We could quit pussyfooting around, damn the collateral damage in innocent lives. That could do it. You think Iraq doesn't help us and I'm confident you are very wrong. I suppose there is little to be done about that, I'd just like you to know I certainly don't favor Iraqis over Americans. Dan B.

To: ChinuSFO who wrote (64295)	7/20/2005 6:23:49 PM
From: lorne	Respond to of 81568

Like I have been saying chinu there are many others in the world who wrongly think as you do. There are a few pictures here of some bearded moslom radicals....not only are they radical but most of the seem to be very ugly as well. Maybe that's why they are radical. The men who blame Britain By George Jones, Political Editor (Filed: 20/07/2005) news.telegraph.co.uk Critics of Tony Blair's policy in Iraq and Afghanistan claimed yesterday that Britain must share some of the responsibility for the Underground and bus bombings in London. While moderate Muslim leaders agreed to try to dissuade disaffected youths from turning to terrorism, radical clerics blamed the Government - and even the public for re-electing Mr Blair - for making the country a target. Mr Blair was forced on the defensive by the leaking of a top secret intelligence report saying that events in Iraq were fuelling "terrorist-related activity" in Britain, while an opinion poll found that two thirds of Britons thought there was a link between the London bombs and the Iraq war. Ken Livingstone, the mayor of London, suggested that decades of western intervention in the Middle East and the Iraq war could have influenced the bombers. "I suspect the real problem was that we funded these people as long as they were killing Russians. We gave no thought to the fact that when they stopped killing Russians they might start killing us." The suggestions that the Government and even the voters must share some of the blame angered Mr Blair and overshadowed talks at No 10 between representatives of the Muslim community and leaders of the main parties. After what were described as "robust and frank" discussions, Muslim leaders agreed to set up a task force to confront radical clerics who were preaching extremism. Mr Blair told them it was time to defeat "this evil ideology" while Michael Howard, the Tory leader, said that Muslim leaders had to prevent "the merchants of evil" from influencing young people in their communities. But the Muslim leaders made clear their concern that the Iraq war could have played a part in radicalising young Muslims. After the talks, Imam Ibrahim Mogra said that, as Muslims, they felt the "pain and suffering of our brothers and sisters around the globe every day". The war had been a "successful recruitment sergeant for people who wish to preach hatred for our country and our Government". Sir Iqbal Sacranie, the secretary general of the Muslim Council of Britain, condemned the bombings as an "act of criminality" but said the leaders had made clear that Mr Blair could not "simply shun the issue of foreign policy". Radical Muslims who did not take part in the talks said they would not be silenced by warnings of new legislation making it a crime to glorify or condone terrorism. Sheikh Omar Bakri Mohammed said that support for America over Afghanistan and Iraq and the re-election of Mr Blair had all contributed to the attacks. "I blame the British Government, the British public and the Muslim community in the UK because they failed to make the extra effort to put an end to the cycle of bloodshed which started before 9/11 and on July 7 was devastating for everybody," he told the Evening Standard. Anjem Choudary, the British leader of the militant Islamist group al-Muhajiroun, said that Muslim leaders should not meet Mr Blair for talks while Muslims were being "murdered" in Iraq. Speaking on Radio 4's Today programme, he declined to condemn the London bombings, which killed 56 people, and said there was "a very real possibility" of a repetition. "The British Government wants to show that they are on the side of justice and of truth, whereas in reality the real terrorists are the British regime, and even the British police, who have tried to divide the Muslim community into moderates and extremists, whereas this classification doesn't exist in Islam." Mr Blair used a press conference with Hamid Karzai, the Afghan president, at No 10 for separate talks, to dismiss the suggestions that Britain's involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan had provoked the attacks. "Of course these terrorists will use Iraq as an excuse," he said. "But let's be clear: if it wasn't that, it would be something else and nothing, but nothing, justifies what they are doing. "They will use whatever is going on in foreign policy to justify what they do, whether it is Iraq, Afghanistan or Palestine, or just generally the fact that Britain is an ally of America." The Prime Minister acknowledged that terrorists were trying to use Iraq as a recruiting tool and a justification for their atrocities but said that to accept that would be to give way to their "perverted logic". He denied that the war on terrorism was being lost but said it would take some time to win. Victory would depend as much on the force of democratic ideas as on military strength.