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To: LindyBill who wrote (132612)	8/15/2005 11:24:47 AM
From: Lane3	Respond to of 793890

You complain about it, but like the rest of your liberal friends, you don't have an viable alternative. Aw, c'mon. You can't blame them for not having viable alternatives. That's going too far. Their viable alternative was not to go into Iraq in the first place in part because they perceived no post-invasion viable alternatives.

To: LindyBill who wrote (132612)	8/15/2005 11:29:03 AM
From: JohnM	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 793890

You complain about it, but like the rest of your liberal friends, you don't have an viable alternative. At the moment, the best outcome I can see is, as I said, a federated state--Kurds in the north, Sunnis in the center, and Shias in the south. Both center and south as theocracies; with the center a very turbulent, possibly broken state, at a low level conflict with its neighbors. And, what is most troubling about this outcome, is that the minority populations in each region are likely to be driven out. That's my sense about ethnic cleansing. The worst outcome, which seems increasingly likely, is the open civil war which draws in other regional states, particularly Syria, Turkey, Iran, and Saudi Arabia. It looks to me as if the Bush administration has concluded it will accept just any momentary solution that will let them withdraw troops and save as much face as possible. But I've typed all this before. I just noticed a brief article in Yahoo that Biden and McCain are calling for more US troops.

To: LindyBill who wrote (132612)	8/15/2005 12:28:11 PM
From: cnyndwllr	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 793890

You complain about it, but like the rest of your liberal friends, you don't have an viable alternative. The answers we hear from the responsible left are "train more Iraqis." That, of course, is precisely what they are doing. Bill, like the rest of your hawkish friends you don't get it. It's not primarily training that's lacking, it's the willingness to die fighting for the principles, leaders and ideals that we're offering. On the other hand, there are some pretty impressive examples of poorly "trained" Iraqis fighting hard AGAINST us and doing some real damage. Not enough "Training," unfortunately, is a euphemism for something else. We should recognize what that is because although through hard work we can show people how to fight, how do we "train" people to have the WILL to fight? Ed