To: Joe NYC who wrote (246859 ) 8/21/2005 6:56:57 PM From: Road Walker Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 1571417 re: The real problem with the bottom 20% is 2 fold: they are not really working, and they are not families (may be partially a cause and effect). But, I think you are right about, say over 10%, under 30% who may be working and supporting a family is still challenging. You are splitting hairs. And "challenging" is a huge understatement. re: On principle that he is a US citizen? No on principle that he is doing an honest days work in the wealthiest country in the world. In that case,, <here comes another Straw Man> why cheapen it by giving the citizenship to people who can't speak English, know nothing and share little of the culture? Why spend billions of dollars on illegal immigrants? I agree. If you note my previous posts, anyone that hires an illegal should go to jail... I think six months minimum is fair, up to 6 years for multiple offences. A slam dunk solution to illegal immigration. re: As I already mention in another post, all private employers operate in a market place, that allows the pay to be only that. No amount of good will on part of the employer can change that. And as I mentioned, a strong enforcement solution to hiring illegal immigrants will reduce the oversupply at the low end of the pay scale. But at the same time, I think corporations and private employers have to take a moral stand and pay living wages. Profits for the S&P 500 are at an all time high, pay for top execs is at an all time high, while wages are close to flat. Fairness. re: But before we settle to something stable like that, I think we will deal with a lot of upheaval resulting from billions of Chinese, Indians and residents of former communist block, who have been freed from the socialist shackles, who are score well on the merit scale, and are hungry to gain the living standard appropriate for their abilities on the meritocratic scale. I guess bottom line that's the difference between you and I... you worry more about the well being of the Chinese and the Indians, and I worry more about Americans. John