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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: mistermj who wrote (174001)	11/3/2005 4:03:27 AM
From: Don Hurst	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

>>"Then we invaded Iraq...and "poof" they became mean old terrorists bent on giving up their lives because of American aggression."<< Yup, amazing isn't it? Before the invasion not one instance of suicide bombing in Iraq...after the invasion, "poof" 100s of suicide bombers.

To: mistermj who wrote (174001)	11/3/2005 6:46:27 AM
From: Noel de Leon	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

"...before the invasion they were just peaceful law abiding childrens day care workers and organic sheep farmers." If you want to believe that, OK. I don't. I can see that irony is lost on you. I'll spell it out: "3) Invasion creates terrorism." reversed: Terrorism creates invasion. Oversimplifying a complex situation serves only demagogues. And RWEs/neocons tend to oversimplify as did Communists. Obviously there is more terrorism today in Iraq than prior to the war. Equally obvious is that there is much less terrorism world wide than prior to the Iraq invasion. So RWEs and neocons would say that on the balance we are better off now than before the invasion of Iraq. A part of the problem is the following: The war on terrorism has no end and that means that the wartime erosion of civil liberties will continue. This is quite different from previous wars. So liberals would say that on the balance we are worse off. Over the long term I side with the latter view. That OBL's recruiting base has widened after the invasion is not contested. Which is a negative in the balance equation. That the US debt is going through the roof as a consequence, among other things, of the invasion is not contested. This is also a negative.

To: mistermj who wrote (174001)	11/3/2005 1:57:20 PM
From: cnyndwllr	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

mjfdl, re: Invasion creates terrorism. Oh thats right...before the invasion they were just peaceful law abiding childrens day care workers and organic sheep farmers. Then we invaded Iraq...and "poof" they became mean old terrorists bent on giving up their lives because of American aggression. Yeah...thats the ticket! The only "poof" is in your head. You see "invasion" isn't just a word and neither is "occupation." There are guns involved, and sounds, and smells, and strangers who look different and don't speak your language. They break down doors and take people away. They tell you when to move, how to move and that you'll die if you don't follow their orders, even orders you don't understand. And they kill. You see babies blown into the air by missiles or bombs and hanging from power lines. You hear grieving, wailing women asking why Allah doesn't kill them all. Members of your own family and some of your friends are dead and you attend their funerals. Resentment and rage build inside you and eventually you become like an insect protecting the hive and you can think of only one thing; killing them. Now you're what they call a "terrorist" and what your people might call a resistance fighter. Now what is it about that very human process that you can't understand? "Poof," do you have it yet? Ed