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Politics : Formerly About Advanced Micro Devices -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: combjelly who wrote (263576)12/6/2005 4:14:14 PM
From: Road Walker  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 1572777
 
And I think many minority party survivors of gerrymandering end up with real secure districts. They may be sentenced to a lifetime as a member of the minority party, but they have great job security... and may not want to give that up to make things more fair for their same party colleagues.

re: Still, it needs to be done.

I think you really need a national populist (as you say) movement. And for that you need a leader. Where is he/she? Most everyone in the system is corrupt.

John

PS Funny how right Ross Perot was, and how ahead of his time. He saw this crap as a huge problem way before I did.



To: combjelly who wrote (263576)12/7/2005 2:02:58 PM
From: tejek  Respond to of 1572777
 
From Der Spiegel:

**************************************************************

GERMAN PAPERS

Does Anyone Believe Condoleezza Rice?

US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice may have left Berlin, but her visit has left all sorts of bad tastes in the mouths of Germans. Nobody seems terribly convinced by her claim that America doesn't torture. And what is "torture" anyway?

US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice may have left Berlin, but her lightening visit on Tuesday is still splashed across the headlines on Wednesday. Nobody, of course, expected the issues raised by Rice's visit to disappear as soon as she did. The attention to the secret CIA flights allegedly carrying terror suspects via Europe to third countries for possible torture is widespread and of grave concern to a number of European governments and the European Union. The implication that Germany may have known about the so-called "extraordinary renditions" -- at least in the case of German citizen Khaled al-Masri, who was kidnapped by CIA agents in Macedonia in late 2003 and taken to Afghanistan where he claims to have been tortured -- has likewise kept the issue on the front pages.

Unfortunately, though, Rice's visit did little to satisfy those who would like to see a bit more transparency from the United States on exactly how European airports and airspace is used by the CIA. She reiterated that the US does not deliver terror suspects to third countries for torture -- but absent a definition of torture, nobody is particularly satisfied by the claim. German Chancellor Angela Merkel, for her part, indicated she was satisfied with Rice's assurance that the US adheres to international laws and conventions with regards to torture. The major German dailies, however, are not so convinced.

For the Financial Times Deutschland, Rice's visit to Berlin did little clear up the many questions surrounding American treatment of foreign terror suspects. "The 'clarity' in the debate over the secret CIA flights and prisons demanded by the Europeans remained absent," the paper writes early in its lead Wednesday editorial. In particular, the paper focuses on US claims that it does not engage in torture. "It remains unclear exactly what definition Washington uses for torture." Indeed, the UN definition of torture refers only to acts "by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental" occur. But other acts constituting "other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment" are also prohibited, although they don't fall under the definition of torture. The paper hypothesizes that the US operates within exactly this "gray zone." And further, that by representing this position, Condoleezza Rice has lost the battle with the hardliners within the US government.

Germany's other financial daily, Handelsblatt, takes a different tack, preferring instead to focus on what it sees as German hypocrisy. The Germans, the paper writes, have made a "regular habit" of presenting themselves as better people than Americans. The "division of labor in the military fight against terror continues to be that the Germans allow the Americans to do the dirty work and take the good bits themselves." In Afghanistan, for example, the Americans go after the Taliban while the Germans build bridges. Meanwhile, the German secret service has very likely known all along what the CIA has been up to. The paper's conclusion? Even as the US turns its back on Western values, the Germans should not imagine that Germany can stay out of the war on terror nor is the country self-evidently untarnished.

But even as the CIA, torture and Germany's potential complicity take center stage, some dailies take a step back and look at the shape of US-German relations. German public opinion has once again been whipped up into almost feverish anti-Americanism as regards the clandestine CIA flights. Regardless, mass circulation Bild argues that Merkel demonstrated true friendship with the United States on Tuesday. "She said what had to be said. At the same time she maintained a balance between voicing a frank opinion to a friend and exposing the other side. That's how true friends treat one another," writes the paper. "Even the United States doesn't expect us to approve of every single action in the war on terror. But they can justifiably expect that we don't assume that their motives are impure."

Center-left Süddeutsche Zeitung, on the other hand, says the time isn't ripe yet for a new trans-Atlantic partnership because Bush is still in power. The German government may have changed, but both sides need to change for a new relationship to take hold. "Injustice remains injustice and a wrong policy remains a wrong policy," writes the paper. "On this basis you can't re-launch the trans-Atlantic relationship." The debate over secret CIA flights and prisons shows how far Europe and the US have drifted apart since Sept. 11 when it comes to what methods are acceptable in waging war on terror. "Condoleezza Rice gave the best example of this by adopting what almost seemed like a blackmailing tone in saying that whoever discloses the work of their intelligence services would have to live with a higher threat of terror," the paper writes. "American secret service information would only be available to allies that could keep silent about how that information was obtained. The message can also be translated thus: The end justifies the means, terrorism can be fought with borderline methods on the outer edges of legality." The paper concludes: "Rice came to Germany to begin a new era. She has resoundingly failed to do so."

Finally, the left-leaning Die Tageszeitung is having trouble digesting Merkel's satisfaction with Rice's claims that the US adheres to international law when it comes to torture. The claims of other government officials are equally disturbing the paper argues. "Do these people not read the newspapers?" the paper implores. "Do they not even pay any attention to the public statements of their negotiating partners?" After all, the American attitude has been made clear enough. "Everything that (the US) wants to do in the process of fighting terror, it is allowed to do," has been the tenor of public comments on the issue by America, the paper writes. With regards to torture, the paper concludes, "nobody should say they couldn't have known after the fact. It has been in the newspapers. For a long time."

service.spiegel.de