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Politics : Formerly About Advanced Micro Devices -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: combjelly who wrote (265275)	12/20/2005 10:33:13 AM
From: Road Walker	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 1574854

re: As I have said before, welcome to 1984, just a little later than Orwell had thought. And their capabilities will only increase with time... there need to be limits enforced and imposed RIGHT NOW. Do the House and Senate and courts have the will to do it?

To: combjelly who wrote (265275)	12/20/2005 10:39:34 AM
From: longnshort	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 1574854

Jimmy Carter Assumed Same Spy Power As Bush Sweetness & Light ^ \| December 19, 2005 \| N/A Almost immediately after the enactment of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978, President Jimmy "the Saint" Carter issued Executive Order #12139: Foreign Intelligence Electronic Surveillance By the authority vested in me as President by Sections 102 and 104 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C. 1802 and 1804), in order to provide as set forth in that Act for the authorization of electronic surveillance for foreign intelligence purposes, it is hereby ordered as follows: 1-101. Pursuant to Section 102(a)(1) of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C. 1802(a)), the Attorney General is authorized to approve electronic surveillance to acquire foreign intelligence information without a court order, but only if the Attorney General makes the certifications required by that Section. 1-102. Pursuant to Section 102(b) of the Foreign Intelligence Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C. 1802(b)), the Attorney General is authorized to approve applications to the court having jurisdiction under Section 103 of that Act to obtain orders for electronic surveillance for the purpose of obtaining foreign intelligence information. 1-103. Pursuant to Section 104(a)(7) of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C. 1804(a)(7)), the following officials, each of whom is employed in the area of national security or defense, is designated to make the certifications required by Section 104(a)(7) of the Act in support of applications to conduct electronic surveillance: (a) Secretary of State. (b) Secretary of Defense. (c) Director of Central Intelligence. (d) Director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation. (e) Deputy Secretary of State. (f) Deputy Secretary of Defense. (g) Deputy Director of Central Intelligence. None of the above officials, nor anyone officially acting in that capacity, may exercise the authority to make the above certifications, unless that official has been appointed by the President with the advice and consent of the Senate. 1-104. [Deleted] 1-105. [Deleted] [Secs. 1-104 and 1-105 amended Executive Order 12036 of Jan. 24, 1978, which was revoked by Executive Order 12333 of Dec. 4, 1981.] Jimmy Carter 1978 Once more, with feeling: [T]he Attorney General is authorized to approve electronic surveillance to acquire foreign intelligence information without a court order, but only if the Attorney General makes the certifications required by that Section. Again, none of this is news, except to the New York Times. And we all know why they are pretending it's new to them.

To: combjelly who wrote (265275)	12/20/2005 11:16:47 AM
From: bentway	Respond to of 1574854

"Could it be that the ones that would probably have been denied were the ones they DIDN'T take them to the court?" I think it goes beyond using the NSA and Echelon. Had he asked for the power to do what he's doing when he started doing it, right after 9/11, Congress would have given it to him. He wanted to keep the whole thing secret. There are two motives for wanting to keep the domestic spying secret. The obvious one is that he didn't want to alert the people he was trying to catch - but anyone who talks in the "open" can't be a very serious threat. Our own criminals are smarter than that. The second motive is that he KNEW there would be objections, that some people would regard it as illegal and a dictatorial power grab, and he just wanted to avoid what's happening NOW. In other words, he KNEW it stunk, but did it anyway.