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To: Elroy Jetson who wrote (48635)	3/25/2006 7:41:03 PM
From: regli	Respond to of 116555

"Since the repeal of Cantonal fines for non-voters, the percentage of participation in Swiss elections is not that much different from America. Yet far more of the Swiss feel "they are their government" than do Americans. Virtually all Americans, of both parties, see the government as "them", some sort of alien occupying force." I agree completely with your take. Though voter participation in Switzerland is much too low, people do not feel estranged from government. Having major issues voted on at least four times a year keeps people involved even if they may not participate in the actual vote. In Switzerland, as it is so easy to resort to a referendum, people know that in the end it is them who made a particular decision.

To: Elroy Jetson who wrote (48635)	3/29/2006 11:59:45 AM
From: shades	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 116555

Representative republics like America are designed to operate with virtually no public participation. I asked jim willie (who says he is a PHD statician) what a good sample size is to represent us in gubbment. 500 congressman as now for 300 million or 5000? Arnold King provided research that we have far too few people representing us in our republic and need 250 states. Message 22063135 It all makes sense to me. So here we all agree we need more representation at a minimum or perhaps a more direct democracy. Yet when I read about rome in the history books - it seems thier greatest years were during the empire and the 5 good emporers - not during the days of republic. Her fall was heavily related to bad budgeting and inability of gubbment to grow administratively with the needs of her people. Same as today in so many countries from what I read. My political science professor said the best form of gubbment was benevolent dictator. Another problem and I will take this from the founding fathers - we have 7 billion people on this planet, 300 million in the USA. About 2 million within 30 minutes of me in fla. It is silly to think that we can bend so many souls to absolute laws and rules and gubbments. 250 states seems like a good idea - all the people with more closely matched ideas can live together. The nudists in fla don't have to offend the church ladys in kansas. Many of my friends say this year, donkey, last election they said elephant - it seems to me they are framing the problem wrong - it is not a donkey/elephant issue - but as you point out - a lack of too few donkeys and elephants. Representative gubbment I guess made sense back in the colonial days of farmers who couldn't leave their crop to take a 2 week journey to washington. Tv, the internet, modern digital age has fundamentally changed things no? We dont need to take a 2 week trip to get to washington - we can turn on C-span and there it is instantly. I don't need to send a guy to a dot on a map to represent my vote anymore - I don't see how anything less than a total breakdown in gubbment in this country will get the change that is required - do you? We could EASE into what is needed - instead it seems much gnashing of teeth will have to be the catalyst.