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Politics : Israel to U.S. : Now Deal with Syria and Iran -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: grampa who wrote (10639)	4/8/2006 2:25:45 PM
From: sea_urchin	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 22250

grampa > I don't for a minute doubt that many of the names that were listed in the first post of this short discussion are in fact Christians That's what I believed and, in fact, I consider Jimmy Carter to be an exemplary person and not only a Christian. He's one of very few of the US "nobility" who is prepared to stand up against the present gang and criticize them. And that must take some doing. > Being a Christian means only that we have asked the Lord to forgive us of the sinful nature that we were born in and the sins we have done since, and have been forgiven. Fundamentally, that's where I differ from the Christian approach. I do not think people are intrinsically "good" or "bad" and moreover I do not accept that mere asking for forgiveness changes much. In fact, I think that's too easy an out. I believe if someone has wronged another person they must make good the damage to THAT person or that person's next of kin and not to the State or some spiritual authority. I also don't accept that certain acts eg adultery, homosexuality, looking at porn, visiting a prostitute, abortion are "bad". I believe it's far better to do those things and finished than live with repressed feelings of guilt which then manifest in even worse ways eg violence against others. What I consider to be "bad" is influencing children to do those things. > It does NOT mean that we are perfect in spite of the way some of us act. That's the whole point. I believe change, if it can occur at all, must come from within the individual in terms of his own understanding of life and not simply as a cloak of piety and assumed self-righteousness which is obtained at the corner store by saying a few glib words.

To: grampa who wrote (10639)	4/28/2006 5:05:53 PM
From: Cyprian	Respond to of 22250

And tho some people take other Bible verses out of context to show that you need "works" to go along with knowledge of Jesus, that is not true. You NEED only a belief in, and love of, Him. Then - because of that belief, you want to do works. But as the thief on the cross showed, he believed at the last moment and was promised that he would be with the Lord "TODAY". --- NO WORKS -- Let it be known that grampa has given the Protestant understanding of justification, which tries to disassociate or separate faith from works when this was never intended to be the case, nor was it ever the accepted teaching of Holy Church In truth, it is the Protestants that take Bible verses out of context to try to support their false doctrines. Their heresiarch Martin Luther even attempted to exclude certain books of the Bible that had been universally accepted by the Church for nearly 1500 years prior, because he could not square his false teachings with the Scriptures or the tradition of the Church.