To: Ramsey Su who wrote (57959 ) 4/12/2006 5:39:20 AM From: russwinter Respond to of 110194 Air, water, and soil conditions are basic requirements for any society, let alone a large and obviously fragile one like China. It is the starting point for everything, if you don't have that, forget about your frigging $10 a day factory job. The more I learn, the more I lean toward some kind of perfect storm die off occurring. I'd say my view on this country has hardened even more and it was hard before, although I'm much more sympathetic to the plight of the little people there. I can even visualize some kind of turn back the clock Khmer Rouge scenario developing. There sure seems to be folks that ought to be in a trench somewhere with a bullet in the head, versus partying in some night club. Discovery Times is running an excellent series on China that I watched last night. They are running again today but it's all daytime rather than evening scheduling. times.discovery.com The programs (Food is Heaven and City of Dreams) answers my question about local citizens caring. They do, especially farmers, fishermen, and folks who depend on the land. They have been victimized by big land grabs, whereby the localities, and provinces basically steal their properties to make way for development for the slash and burn pirates, I mean developers. An incredible number of both rural and urban people have been displaced in these corrupt crony capitalist schemes. Then the local governments totally ignore citizen complaints about obvious serious pollutions. Discovery covered a quite sickening story about some egregious dumping of animal remains into a river by a leather plant rendering a once productive and secnic waterway not only useless, but a serious health hazard. The locals were able to bring in some rare breed crusading lawyer to help them, but you got the sense, that despite obvious and egregious conduct, the process of correction would be difficult. In the US, companies doing this would be shut down immediately, and subject to losing billion dollar suits. The central government in Bejing seems largely ineffective and impotent, usually only acting when there are ten million fish floating belly up down some waterway.