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Politics : Formerly About Advanced Micro Devices -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: bentway who wrote (285426)	4/24/2006 7:14:55 PM
From: longnshort	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 1573352

No Proof of Secret C.I.A. Prisons, European Says E-MailPrint Save By DAN BILEFSKY International Herald Tribune Published: April 20, 2006 BRUSSELS, April 20 — The European Union's antiterrorism chief told a hearing today that he has not been able to prove that secret C.I.A. prisons existed in Europe. "We've heard all kinds of allegations," the official, Gijs de Vries, said before a packed chamber of deputies. "It does not appear to be proven beyond reasonable doubt." But Mr. de Vries came under criticism from some legislators who called the hearing a whitewash. "The circumstantial evidence is stunning," said Kathalijne Buitenweg, a Dutch member of Parliament from the Green Party, even if there is no smoking gun. "I'm appalled that we keep calling to uphold human rights while pretending that these rendition centers don't exist and doing nothing about it," she said. Mr. de Vries said the European Parliament investigation, and a similar probe by the Council of Europe, had not uncovered rights abuses despite more than 50 hours of testimony by rights activists and alleged victims who say they were abducted by C.I.A. agents. A number of legislators challenged Mr. de Vries for not taking seriously earlier testimony before the committee by a German and a Canadian who gave accounts of being kidnapped and kept imprisoned by foreign agents. Allegations that the C.I.A. hid and interrogated Al Qaeda suspects at compounds in Eastern Europe, reported on Nov. 2, 2005, in The Washington Post, has raised trans-Atlantic tensions and embarrassed European governments. The committee also heard today from a former British ambassador to Uzbekistan, Craig Murray, who said, "I can attest to the willingness of the U.S. and the U.K. to obtain intelligence that was got under torture in Uzbekistan. "If they were not willing, then rendition prisons could not have existed," he added. But Mr. Murray, who was recalled from his job in 2004 after condemning the Uzbek authorities and criticizing the British and American governments, told the committee that he had no proof that detention centers existed within Europe. He said he had witnessed such rendition programs in Uzbekistan, but he seemed to back up Mr. de Vries's assertion when he said he was not aware of anyone being brought to Uzbekistan from Europe. "As far as I know, that never happened," Mr. Murray said. While he was ambassador, Mr. Murray made many public statements condemning the regime of President Islam Karimov of Uzbekistan for its poor human rights record. At the time, Washington was using Uzbekistan as a base for American operations in Afghanistan after the Sept. 11 attacks. Mr. Murray, who has been criticized by Foreign Secretary Jack Straw of Britain for breaching diplomatic protocol, has written an account of his experiences called "Murder in Samarkand" that is to be made into a film by the British director, Michael Winterbottom. Mr. Murray said that he had evidence the United States delivered suspected terrorists to countries where they were likely to be tortured. He added that Washington and London used intelligence extracted by torture in countries ranging from Syria to Morocco, but that American and European officials did not conduct the torture themselves. In January, Dick Marty, a Swiss investigator for the Council of Europe, a human rights watchdog organization, said there was evidence that the United States was engaged in a system of "outsourcing of torture." But he did not offer irrefutable proof of clandestine C.I.A. prisons in Europe. Mr. Marty said it was "highly unlikely" that European governments or their intelligence services were not aware of a system of "relocation" or "outsourcing of torture." Gee, and from the Commie Times to boot!: nytimes.com

To: bentway who wrote (285426)	4/24/2006 10:26:45 PM
From: SilentZ	Respond to of 1573352

>I don't really know his exact position vis a vis Israel, I've just never heard him criticize Israel for anything. Yes, but few Senators do. He at least has supported the idea of a Palestinian state lukewarmly, more than I can say for a hell of a lot of Senators. I've also read he's against settlement expansion. He really isn't much to the right of John Kerry on his Israel policy, but he's stayed to the right on the war, which obviously irks me to no end and I could never vote for him. >AIPAC loves the guy. AIPAC loves lots of Senators... On another disturbing front, Israel Radio (Kol Yisrael), reported on Oct. 3, 2001, that Israel’s Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, had boasted at a Cabinet meeting, “I want to tell you something very clear, don’t worry about American pressure on Israel, we, the Jewish people control America, and the Americans know it.” Keep an eye on your sources... we went over this one a couple of years ago, and it wasn't Kol Yisrael that made this quote... it was a Palestinian publication. -Z