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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: epicure who wrote (189170)	6/13/2006 1:26:52 PM
From: Wharf Rat	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 281500

Then maybe they shouldn't have bombed Pearl Harbor. And maybe they should have surrendered after the first bomb, instead of trying to pull a coup after the second to keep from surrendering. And maybe they shouldn't have raped Nanking.

To: epicure who wrote (189170)	6/13/2006 2:29:24 PM
From: KLP	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Seems to me that the Germans pretty much wiped out hundreds of thousands of people during WWII as well, to say nothing of the cities of Europe. And the Japanese seemed to think nothing of sending thousands of people, including Americans to their graves early. And then there are the prison camps...... Yes...an then there are millions of people worldwide who were killed by the Germans, the Italians, and Japanese, and their allies. And maybe we should talk about incineration there as well......

To: epicure who wrote (189170)	6/13/2006 6:54:58 PM
From: Brumar89	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

The fire-bombing of Japanese and German cities was horrific but was obviously not sufficiently bad to end the war. Fire-bombing of Japanese cities killed many more civilians than the atom bombs did. Of course, both Japan and Germany had committed massive atrocities against other nations prior to their being bombed. And if Japanese and German bombers had been able to reach our shores they would have done the same. Had either of them been the first to develop nuclear weapons, they would have eagerly used them as massive tools for genocide. the demoralization and defeat of the Japanese has very little to tell us about Iraq (unless we want to bomb the cities of Iraq to oblivion). This is a silly comparison. The bulk of the Iraqi population is not our enemy and supports our efforts. It is our opponents who are bombing, as well as they can, the Iraqi cities hoping to shock them into submission.

To: epicure who wrote (189170)	6/15/2006 9:54:16 AM
From: Hawkmoon	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 281500

We could never get away with doing in Iraq, what was done in Japan. I don't even think we could get away with doing to Japan what was done to Japan, in this more modern age of new reporting. The question you should be asking is why nations like Iran (with its suicide child brigades), Afghanistan under the Taliban (where terrorists were harbored and attempts to "Jihadize" the entire population, or Saddam's regime (with its genocidal oppression of Kurds and Shi'a), or N. Korea (with its mass starvation tactics) are able to do what they are doing in this modern age of news reporting. And while you're at it, ask yourself how Islamic (Ba'thist?) insurgents in Iraq are able to target and murder hundreds of innocent civilians each month with merely a "oh well, nothing we can do about it".. And then ask why in "this more modern age of news reporting", people like yourself seem to absolve yourself of any responsibility for confronting these forms of evil, especially when 3,000 Americans died as a result of this indifference (apathy?) that has been encouraged by the left. Y'all have high-minded morale values about what we should represent as a people and nation/state. And that's admirable since we should always seek to better ourselves as human beings and a civilized people. But don't forget that WE STILL LIVE in a world that is dominated by powerful forces/ideologues WHO DO NOT SHARE YOUR VALUES and wouldn't shed a tear if they were able to kill you and your family. And when you forget, it the job of the pragmatists like me, as well as the conservatives and everyone else, TO REMIND YOU that sometimes we have to bring ourselves down to the level of our enemies, so they have no doubt that we can engage in the same measure of brutality as themselves. Our enemies must NEVER BE PERMITTED TO FORGET that our desire to be civilized, tolerant, and secular is NOT a weakness of character on our part. And if they choose to mis-calculate and pick a fight with us, or support those who have, then we can get just as "down and dirty" as themselves. No better friend, no worse enemy.. It's a mantra to live by, if you want to gain respect (fear?) with these types of people. Hawk