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Politics : GOPwinger Lies/Distortions/Omissions/Perversions of Truth -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: one_less who wrote (68787)	6/14/2006 1:02:40 AM
From: PartyTime	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 173976

>>>Phillips: "We ignorned warnings about al-Qaeda and we know what happened." Gemstone: Before 911, for every warning about Al-Qaeda type threats, there were hundreds or thousands that we refused to respond to for good reason.<<< Where'd you get that from? >>>The American Consiousness was absolutely against responding with force to such non-military and obscure threats.<<< The American consciousness--were you with 'em?--was on Monica Lewinsky. Now, I've constantly observed your writing supporting the freaks or creeps--pick one!--who wanted America to concentrate more on Monica than OBL! >>>Al-Qaeda was some vague and obscure (to mainstream America) foreign cultural force that was operating to repel Russian oppressors and in support of something few of us understood (Taleban) that could only be explained through intricate knowledge of Afghan lifestyle and history.<<< Bull! One of Bush's first acts as president was to give the Taliban 43 million and to put a block on the US intelligence from investigating anything Saudi or Afghanistan pipeline-related (for Enron!). >>>Phillips: "We ignorned warnings about sectarian strife in Iraq. Look what happened." Gemstone: We viewed The Bathist Regime of Iraq as a secular government ruling over one culture of like minded people.<<< We? Them? What did that have to do with the logic of it all? >>>That view was uniformed. I still hear Bush critics talking about what Iraqis want as if Iraq were a united monoculture.<<< Iraqis wanna be free from death, they want electricity and probably would like to sell their oil at fair market rates! They'd probably also like their children to have a future!!! >>>There were plenty of warnings about what would take place once the regime was defeated.<<< Oh, really? Can you cite a warning in particular from the GOPwinger side? >>>The goal was to introduce the idea of a liberal democracy as an alternative to extreme sectarian violence.<<< So this is why the public Iraqi buildings housing records of citizenship were so easily looted and the only public ministry building that got protected was the Iraqi Oil Ministry building! You're really trying to reinvent history, Gemstone! >>>That is still the goal and still has potential to succeed. The worst case I can imagine now is three autonomous regions instead of one nation. Which would not be too bad.<<< Sure, that wouldn't be bad in your world so long as the US has permanent military bases around them oil parts! Sometimes you should go back and read what you've written. This is one of them! >>>Phillips: "We ignorned warnings about Katrina. Look what happened. Every year we have hundreds of warnings during the hurricane season. We have known for several decades what the risks were. We have had several near misses and Katrina was following a similar pattern as those. We also have hundreds of warnings of earth quakes, volcanos, tornados, plague, pestilance, drought, economic collapse, invasions, astroids, etc. All have some validity.<<< So why are you supporting people who won't do anything about this? >>>Phillips: "Now, we are ignoring warnings about climate change." I don't think any of these things have been ignored.<<< I hate to inform you of this, but you're in very deep denial. Look at the political hack appointees in government science!!! >>>There is a difference between the caution of wise counsel when assessing risks and making reasonable preparations vs politicizing science.<<< Sometimes I think you write only to see how your words fit. Put better ideas behind what you write. Why would there be caution to wise counsel? Phillips: "when the search for truth is confused with political advocacy, the pursuit of knowledge is reduced to the quest for power." (Alston Chase) >>>Remember 'Eugenics'? Very popular a few years ago especially in Nazi Germany but it had the attention and support of prominent politicians world wide. Supporters like Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, Winston Churchill, Oliver Wendell Holmes, Louis Brandeis, Alexander Graham Bell, Margaret Sanger; Luther Burbank; Leland Stanford, H. G. Wells; George Bernard Shaw; and many others. The outcome was devastating. Remember 'Vernalization'? The result was famines that killed millions, and purges that sent hundreds of dissenting Soviet scientists to the gulags or the firing squads.<<< Well, I'll ignore this portion of the Phillips-Gemstone debate.