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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Lane3 who wrote (23586)	7/10/2006 6:14:49 PM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541556

I think the embryo destruction thing is a big problem for any person or group who believes "life begins at conception" -- or some permutation thereof, I know I know that it's a very imprecise statement and let's not go there, please. Fast forward to what they really mean, which is that a fertilized egg is "human" in an ethical/moral/legal sense. Slippery slopes aside, religious beliefs aside, that's the bedrock from which all objections flow (sorry for mixed metaphor). There's some weird factual/logical lacunae involved, yes. Some of the weirder being that, not only does using birth control pills make it more likely to spontaneously abort a fertilized egg rather than implant it, so does "the rhythm method." But if you use "the rhythm method" and then spontaneously abort a fertilized egg, that's God's will, and none of the rest are, apparently. Don't shoot me, I'm just the messenger.

To: Lane3 who wrote (23586)	7/10/2006 8:12:29 PM
From: TimF	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541556

The Catholic Church is not a good indicator of any of this because the Church objects to in vitro for reasons other than the destruction of embryos and that confuses the issue. But it also objects because of the destruction of the embryos, it would object if that was the only concern, and it probably is a greater source of concern for them than any of the other issues. Also I doubt the Catholic Church is the only opponent of in vitro fertilization (either in general or the way it is normally practiced) its just the most prominent opponent. Still, you'd thing the subject of fertility clinics would come up more often than it does if the horror were equal. Think of how many diseases or atrocities or wars that kill a certain number of people, get a lot more attention than other diseases or atrocities or wars that kill a much greater number of people. If you did more about Bosnia than you did about Rwanda; if you care more about breast cancer than lung cancer or AIDS than heart disease; if you are/were more horrified by the Holocaust than the deaths caused by communism; you aren't necessarily ignorant or illogical. Some issues get pushed over others for tactical reasons, other just resonate more on an emotional level or are more easily grasped by people or are more well known or are issues where the other side is trying to move things away from the status quo. Federal funding of stem cell research has grown as an issue because there was an attempt to change from now funding to widespread funding. When someone is trying to change things people are more likely to object than they are to object to the status quo. The attempt, so far has fallen short, funding has been allowed but only very limited funding for a few stem cell lines. This compromise hasn't settled the issue, it has left it in play. An issue currently in play, and active issues get more attention. Also the issue is one of federal funding. Just as in the abortion issue, there are some who, object to the destruction embryos (or blastocysts or fetuses) and find it to be immoral or even unjust to destroy them, but at the same time would not go so far as to make the practice illegal. But someone could easily object to any government funding, or perhaps just federal funding, of the activity whether its abortion, the destruction of embryos in fertility clinics, or fetal stem cell research.

To: Lane3 who wrote (23586)	7/11/2006 1:01:15 PM
From: TimF	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541556

[The Catholic Church is not a good indicator of any of this because the Church objects to in vitro for reasons other than the destruction of embryos and that confuses the issue.] I really don't think that matters. The Catholic Church represents many people, of course many of them aren't very serious about their religon or don't agree with the church on this one, but even if you do only count those in line with the teaching of the church on this issue it amounts to many millions of people. You seem to be trying to paint almost all opponents of stem cell research in to the same corner, this examples shows that you can't reasonably do that. Tim