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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (191717)	7/15/2006 3:10:02 AM
From: RMF	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Hawk...Carl is right about the Russians. They were the guys that won the war for Europe. If they had just folded then we would have had to decide if we wanted to try and invade against a Germany that had just ONE front...us. We probably would have held off in that case until we had the A-bomb. The Russian troops had NO choice but to fight, but you still have to give them credit for fighting maybe the most intense battle ever fought. Except for the Japanese, of course, they buried themselves in tunnels and many of them wouldn't come out until they were on fire.

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (191717)	7/15/2006 5:30:53 AM
From: Bilow	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Hi Hawkmoon; Re: "Geezus.. we had 12 Million men and women in uniform!!! And not all of them were sailors or airmen." Nearly every American who fought in WW2 got to the battlefield on a boat, and a lot of them fought on a boat. Very few of the Russians did. Despite the US being the "arsenal of democracy", the Soviet Union built 25% more self propelled guns, twice the artillery and nearly twice the mortars that the US did. The US built 141 aircraft carriers. Japan built 16, Britain built 14. These were the primary naval powers. Germany built 2 and the USSR built none. The US built 48 cruisers, the Soviet Union 2, Germany zero. Germany built 1337 submarines, the US 422, the USSR built 52. These numbers indicate which of the parties were primarily fighting on land and which were primarily fighting on water. When the Japanese attacked at Pearl Harbor their primary goal was to destroy US naval vessels. This was for a reason. Re: "Yeah.. we didn't lose as many men as the Russians, but then gain we weren't into using human wave assaults or "penal companies". Hell, the Russians couldn't normally advance any further than a full tank of gas, because they didn't have the necessary logistics to support their attacks." The largest battle of the war was at Stalingrad. During that battle, the Germans lost more men than the Russians. Re: "As for the Pacific being a Naval Battle, of course the US had to control the seas.. just like we needed to control any other lines of communications in our battles on land." You're basically an idiot who knows nothing of strategy. It's hilarious that you're willing to sit there and claim that WW2 was, for the US, a "land war in Asia", despite all evidence to the contrary, and no matter how stupid it makes you look. -- Carl

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (191717)	7/15/2006 11:58:35 AM
From: Still Rolling	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Hawk, Interesting discussion about WW2. I see two truths that appear contradictory at first: (1) the US alone could have defeated the combined might of every other industrial nation, but (2) it was the Soviet Union broke the back of the German war machine. By December 1941, when Germany had already lost half a million men in their futile attempt to take Moscow, the war was lost for them. The Nazi killing machine would go on for another 3-1/2 years, but by June 1944 Germany was already broken beyond repair. Yes, allied bombing was huge, but German industrial output was strong through 1944.