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Politics : Formerly About Advanced Micro Devices -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: RetiredNow who wrote (300529)8/18/2006 12:21:12 AM
From: TigerPaw  Respond to of 1578452
 
The neocons of the U.S. and Israel are losing this so called war on terror because they fight a pretend enemy instead of dealing with the actual facts, which aren't nearly as black and white as Junior pretends.

TP



To: RetiredNow who wrote (300529)8/18/2006 3:03:44 AM
From: tejek  Read Replies (5) | Respond to of 1578452
 
I agree, but the people of Lebanon are part of the greater Arab world, which is full of false pride and bullshit machismo.

No. Hezbollah provides the Lebanese people all kinds of social services. Its how they win their hearts and minds. Same with Hamas.



To: RetiredNow who wrote (300529)8/18/2006 12:02:02 PM
From: tejek  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 1578452
 
Well at least the Israelis are smart enough to realize that things did not work out the way they thought they would.

With Guns Silent, Wartime Unity Unravels in Israel Amid Fierce Criticism of War Effort

By GREG MYRE
Published: August 18, 2006
JERUSALEM, Aug. 17 — In a country where raucous debate is the norm, Israelis set aside differences during war. They even have an expression for it: “Quiet. We’re shooting.”

Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, Defense Minister Amir Peretz and the military’s chief of staff, Lt. Gen. Dan Halutz, are all facing fierce, even vitriolic criticism in a country accustomed to swift and decisive battlefield triumphs against Arab enemies.

“Because everyone served in the army, every Israeli thinks he’s a generalissimo,” said Shlomo Avineri, a political science professor at Hebrew University. “The achievements were less than expected, and the price was too high.”

He added: “From the beginning we should have set more modest goals. A lot of this agonizing is self-inflicted.”

A sizable number of Israelis have challenged the claims of their leaders that Israel won the war against Hezbollah.

“It’s not a victory at all,” said Ziona Dotan, 50, who returned to her rocket-damaged apartment in the hard-hit northern town of Kiryat Shmona on Wednesday. “It’s going backwards. They keep getting more weapons. I don’t see what we got out of this. Many people were killed, and what was it all for?”

An Israeli radio poll released Thursday found that 28 percent of the 513 respondents believed Israel won, 24 percent believed Hezbollah won, and 36 percent thought neither side came out on top. The poll had a margin of sampling error of 4.5 percentage points. Two polls released Wednesday showed similar results.

Israelis overwhelmingly supported the government decision to hit hard after Hezbollah staged a cross-border raid on July 12, killing three Israeli soldiers and seizing two more, who remain captive in Lebanon.

But as the fighting dragged on and the Israeli military faced tough resistance from Hezbollah in south Lebanon, criticism began to emerge. The most common themes: The politicians were indecisive. The military relied too much on air power. The ground offensive should have been started sooner, and on a larger scale.

“At the beginning of the war there was unity, but now it’s broken down because there were many mistakes, by the army and also politically,” said Yakov Hoshkover, 66, who works at a parking lot in the northern coastal town of Nahariya, which was repeatedly hit by Hezbollah rockets.

The grumbling turned into a flood of criticism after a United Nations Security Council resolution to stop the fighting was approved last Friday and a cease-fire took effect on Monday.

“There were many failures,” Benjamin Netanyahu, the opposition leader, said in Parliament this week. “Failures in identifying the threat, failures in preparing to meet the threat, failures in the management of the war, failures in the management of the home front.”

Israel has often been led by former generals or others with long military experience, and Mr. Olmert and Mr. Peretz, who assumed their positions in recent months, had limited military backgrounds. Their performance during the war only raised more doubts.

Mr. Olmert’s approval rating, which shot up to 78 percent on July 19, one week into the war, fell to 40 percent in a poll published Wednesday in Maariv, a leading daily.

Fifty-three percent of those questioned said Israel should have kept on fighting, while 42 percent said Israel was right to agree to a cease-fire. The poll questioned 500 Jewish Israelis on Tuesday and had a margin of error of 4.4 percentage points.

In a front-page opinion article on Thursday, Nahum Barnea, the most prominent columnist in Yediot Aharonot, the country’s top-selling newspaper, called for the resignation of Mr. Peretz, a former trade union leader whose army service consisted largely of repairing tanks.

“The appointment of Amir Peretz as defense minister was a crazy idea,” Mr. Barnea wrote.

With criticism of the war effort mounting, Mr. Peretz on Wednesday appointed a panel to review how the Defense Ministry and the military performed.

But that move also drew criticism from politicians who said Mr. Peretz quickly put together a handpicked panel with the aim of heading off a more thorough review by an independent body.

The Haaretz newspaper reported Thursday that Mr. Peretz said the military played down the threat of Hezbollah’s missiles when briefing him after he took office in May.

General Halutz, meanwhile, is also facing mounting calls to quit after a newspaper disclosed that he sold about $28,000 worth of mutual fund shares just hours after the Hezbollah raid on July 12.

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nytimes.com