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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: GST who wrote (200612)	9/1/2006 1:14:52 PM
From: Ichy Smith	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

You want to justify crimes and atrocities. I want to call them what they are and to see them stopped and to see those who commit them held accountable. So the US created al Qaeda by creating Bin laden, you owe the world to fix that. The US created Saddam Hussein, and the US armed him and made him into a monster. you owe the world to fix that. If Israel is overcome, the world will lose an historic tribe of greatness, how could the US not save that.

To: GST who wrote (200612)	9/1/2006 1:17:37 PM
From: Hawkmoon	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

You want to justify crimes and atrocities. I want to call them what they are and to see them stopped and to see those who commit them held accountable. No you don't. You don't give a sh*t when some totalitarian regime commits genocide, or deliberately targets civilians. You sit on your @ss and keep your mouth shut. As far as you're concerned, the entire world could be subjugated and oppressed, with skulls and skeletons being stacked up in fields, and you wouldn't care. But let the US or Israel commit act where an innocent civilian is killed, and my god.. it's a war crime. It doesn't matter if we didn't mean to do it, or because the target of our attack was hiding behind civilian shields, it's a war crime. If we hold true to our values and principles we CANNOT be defeated by terrorism. But if we show ourselves to be weak and abandon our values and principles, using the behavior of terrorists as our justification, then we have in fact defeated ourselves and destroyed America. Is that what we did in WWII? Did we show ourselves to be "weak" by bombing the living daylights out of Germany and Japan?? A case study of note, that I often recall, is when we bombed the French city of Caen, with no warning, in hopes of catching the 12SS Panzer Division and destroying/decimating it with airpower.. We killed 5,000 French citizens.. men, women, and children (and their dogs and cats too) in less than an hour. And even worse, we didn't even succeed in disrupting that SS division. It had moved outside of the city prior to the air raid. Can you imagine how CNN would have played that one up today?? 5,000 innocent people who we were supposed to be "liberating" killed in under an hour, with no major damage to the actual enemy? That's just ONE AIR-RAID out of THOUSANDS that the Allies conducted against Italy, Germany, France, Sicily, Romania, Austria, Hungary, Czechoslovakia.. etc, etc... I haven't even touched upon the "fire-bombings" of Germany and Japan, let alone the 150,000 people who were killed at Hiroshima or Nagasaki.. And you know something.. we have nothing to apoligize for.. Because war is brutal. And nations that are engaged in war will do what they need to do, however brutal, to kill as many of the enemy, while preserving the lives of their own people. That's what war is all about, pal.. And the winner get to write the histories. Hawk