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To: E. Charters who wrote (20222)	9/5/2006 7:22:51 PM
From: John McCarthy	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 78408

Hi E.C. (woulda got back quicker by while I was at work my wife decided to take down the kitchen wallpaper - I woulda let it go another 20 years but anyway - I got "drafted" into mopping the kitchen floor - TWICE. Please don't tell anyone on the mining boards ..... ) - put me in the pollyanna economics school of thought ..... England thru (as opposed to threw) out the cost accounting book and is committed to have (IS IT 25%) of their future energy coming from windmills by either (I forget) 2025 or 2040 .... a google would get the facts. Moreover, I suspect this effort is not a static dimensional thingie but will dimentionalize (is that a new word?) once some of the stuff is on board and people have a track record with it .... i.e. pollyanna .... More mysteriously, Mr. 'I am the nuke power country', France - has committed to a similiar but LESS ambitious scheme ..... (don't know what that means for 2030 uranium prices) and a google would get the facts on these ..... my point being those two countries had to hit on the same tree bark that you posted ..... and decided to build a bigger axe anyway .... BUT I could be wrong ...... With respect to the United States .... The good ole United States have two people in power who first learned of wind power by doing a google on the word KATRINA .... but I suspect they DON'T and CAN't make the jump to energy power .... What somewhat troubled me about your post was the 2nd philisophical point within it ..... a valid point but not one a pollyanna would hang onto i.e. the status of CURRENT GADGETS ..... lets go back to 1978 ..... your E.C. and you invent something called an 8086 chip you ask me for advice .... as to what to do with it I tell you to shitcan it .... because .... what the world NEEDS (remember it is 1978) is a dual core pentium 5 chip ..... to run all software that will be available 25 years from now .... you throw it in a dumpster and your next door neighbor - a SHOE SALESMEN - named Mr. Intel finds your paperwork takes it to his friend who ain't no J. McCarthy and you know the rest of the story .... yes - long winded and trite (the above)- which is my point .... once money gets thrown at something - STUFF HAPPENS ... stuff that did not exist YESTERDAY .... (which was the day you did your analysis) screw the numbers - invest 2 billion a year in solar energy and sumptin's gonna stick .... I just don't know when .... btw - this is exactly analagous to building the FIRST ICBM fleet before anyone had ever built it ..... because ..... its costs didn't matter because w/o it - the entire ASSET BASE of the country it was for was at risk ... anyone ... I covered my tracks ... at the opening I mop and I'm a pollyanna .... regards, John

To: E. Charters who wrote (20222)	9/5/2006 11:22:09 PM
From: sageyrain	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 78408

Right now, putting a wind system into Ontario without a premium being paid by the province -- with the attendant miserly rate of "power payout" by OPG, perhaps 3.5 cents for supplied kw hrs -- a rate that OPG itself cannot possibly achieve on its own as a cost, either by building nuclear, gas or water power generation -- is not economic. Crestreet (CRS.UN) has a longterm windpower purchase agreement with Hydroquebec for .056/kw hr, rising 1.5%/year for 21 years, and with Nova Scotia Power for .068/kw hr for 15 to 18 years. They get a .01/ kw hr incentive payment from the Feds for the 1st 10 years for the Quebec project, with .005/ kw hr of that incentive payment turned over to HydroQuebec. They have one Ontario Project in the pipeline, Grand Valley (40 Mw). It will be interesting to see what they can negotiate with Ontario Power.