To: TobagoJack who wrote (10280 ) 10/19/2006 11:16:09 PM From: Maurice Winn Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 220319 TJ, I think that Tibet's and China's relationship is more one of conqueror and conquered, rather than provincial harmony and happy comingling following synergistic merger and treaty between sovereign parties as was the case between the Queen, Great Britain and sundry Maori tribes. To equate the two is akin to equating Japan's and China's happy harmony before the war with the USA got underway. While I'm sure there were plenty of relationships between Japanese administrators of China and Chinese ladies, I'm not sure that they would be necessarily totally voluntary. Rumour has it that some Chinese ladies consider it not the case. I suspect the joy in Tibet with China's administration is similar. On scales of 0 to 10 of total coercion to total voluntarism, I'm sure you'd understand that not all relationships fit at the same point on the scale. New Zealand is also nearer 0 than 10, but above China [and one can check immigration pressure to see which is better - people do NOT press to get into Iraq, Albania, North Korea or other near-zero countries]. <how would you like to situate the tibetan non-issue, tracing the progression of treaties and laws or delving into natural evolution? > I would like to situate it as China is a barbarian state, not worthy of being considered a civilized place. Which [to save you drooling like Pavlov's dogs] is the case for all states; albeit to a lesser extent for many, and a greater extent for many. On a scale of 0 to 10, China is nearer zero than 10. While I will continue to try to drag China into the 21st century and act in a civilized way, I don't expect that to happen any time soon. But to feel good about China's wonderful ways, compare China's relationship with Tibet to what went on in Rwanda, when there was mass genocide by machete. People whine about China using body parts of executed criminals, as though there is something wrong with that. In the USA, the funeral directors who get hold of the body simply steal the components for their own purposes and cash flow. It's tough to find Virtuous Values anywhere. Mqurice