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Politics : Actual left/right wing discussion -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: J_F_Shepard who wrote (4040)	11/2/2006 10:20:40 AM
From: TimF	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 10087

"Kerry’s troop-bashing remarks belie the truth about the educational level of U.S. troops. According to figures readily available on the Internet, 99.9 percent of the enlisted forces have at least a high school education, 73.3 percent have some college, 16.2 percent have an associate’s degree or equivalent semester hours, and 4.7 have a bachelor’s degree. What’s more, over 85 percent of field grade officers have advanced degrees – 70.7 percent have master’s degrees, 12.1 percent have professional degrees and 2.5 percent have doctorate degrees." newsmax.com ---- Here is the figures from 1999. 99.3% of the military enlisted had at least a high school diploma or GED, compared to 88.6% of the general population aged 18 to 44. I think the military does even better now. Obviously officers have a higher level of educational achievement. dod.mil Here is up to date information for the airforce - Academic Education -- 48.8 percent of officers have advanced or professional degrees; 39.2 percent have master's degrees, 8.4 percent have professional degrees and 1.3 percent have doctorate degrees. -- 22.4 percent of company grade officers have advanced degrees; 16.6 percent have master's degrees, 5.5 percent have professional degrees and 0.3 percent have doctorate degrees. -- 85.6 percent of field grade officers have advanced degrees; 70.5 percent have master's degrees, 12.5 percent have professional degrees and 2.7 percent have doctorate degrees. -- 99.9 percent of the enlisted force have at least a high school education; 73.6 percent have some semester hours toward a college degree; 16 percent have an associate's degree or equivalent semester hours; 4.7 percent have a bachelor's degree; 0.7 percent have a master's degree and .01 percent have a professional or doctorate degree. Developmental Education -- 57 percent of officers have completed one or more PME or developmental education course either in residence or by correspondence; 8,530 have completed at least one senior service school or senior developmental education course, 14,874 have completed an intermediate level course while 17,996 have completed Squadron Officer School. military.com Reader Andrew Porsch responds to Kerry: I’m currently attending American University in Washington, DC, but I enlisted in the Army immediately after my graduation from high school. Guess my decision to enlist prior to going to college means I was lazy, uneducated, and don’t want to even attempt anything academic. Oh, by the way, I was a Korean linguist in the Army. Mr. Kerry, I served in Afghanistan, and proudly at that. Nobody forced me to join the Army - my parents were supportive of my decision and I don’t reget a second of my service. My enlistment was not a punishment or a final option as a result of being lazy and not wanting to put forth any "brain power." Some people just happen to be patriotic or want to better themselves through the military. Andrew Porsch Proud former (and possibly future) Soldier More reax: Michelle, I really became ticked off about the message John Kerry is sending to my kids, those serving, and those who have served. He is saying that I'm uneducated and to stupid to do anything else! Well, I would rather have any 100 random service men or women serve in the Senate than the current group we currently have serving today. Jerry Kerry has inherited all of his wealth, other than his very short time in the Navy, I would say he has not really worked a day in his life. Effectively he has been working on the public dole his whole life. So, who really is smarter? My father served in the Air Force, served in Korea, and 3 tours in Vietnam, earned a bachelors degree, Masters degree, and almost finished his PhD before retiring from the USAF as a Chief Master Sergeant (NCO). I earned a BS in Engineering, volunteered to serve in the Army as an officer, earned an MBA while serving, fought in combat twice, and retired from the service. The men and women I served with in the military are better than the average person you walk into on the street. There are many reasons why that is true, but the big one is that they give a damn about our Nation. Maj. Ben M. Bauman II (U.S. Army, Ret.) michellemalkin.com

To: J_F_Shepard who wrote (4040)	11/2/2006 10:25:21 AM
From: TimF	Respond to of 10087

I believe it's true that during the Vietnam war, about 30% of the combat troops, ie "grunts", were minorities.... RACE AND ETHNIC BACKGROUND * 88.4% of the men who actually served in Vietnam were Caucasian, 10.6% (275,000) were black; 1% listed as others. my.eiis.net -- Myth: A disproportionate number of blacks were killed in the Vietnam War. 86% of the men who died in Vietnam were Caucasians, 12.5% were black, 1.2% were other races. (CACF and Westmoreland) Sociologists Charles C. Moskos and John Sibley Butler, in their recently published book "All That We Can Be," said they analyzed the claim that blacks were used like cannon fodder during Vietnam "and can report definitely that this charge is untrue. Black fatalities amounted to 12 percent of all Americans killed in Southeast Asia - a figure proportional to the number of blacks in the U.S. population at the time and slightly lower than the proportion of blacks in the Army at the close of the war." [All That We Can Be] Myth: The war was fought largely by the poor and uneducated. Servicemen who went to Vietnam from well-to-do areas had a slightly elevated risk of dying because they were more likely to be pilots or infantry officers. Vietnam Veterans were the best educated forces our nation had ever sent into combat. 79% had a high school education or better. [McCaffrey] vhfcn.org

To: J_F_Shepard who wrote (4040)	11/2/2006 1:07:13 PM
From: Jim S	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 10087

"...what evidence do you have that he is wrong that the people we have as "combat" troops are not at the lower levels of the academic spectrum..." You're grasping at straws, JF. Military people chalk in at different ranges of the educational spectrum, from "mere" HS grads to PhDs. More than 80% of mid level managers (majors and above) have masters degrees or better. About 97% of all military people have at least HS diplomas. Roughly 97% of all officers have at least a bachelor's degree from an accredited college. Now you want some survey to show the educational level of "combat" troops. Since "combat troops" include pilots, marine riflemen, artillery troops, and combat engineers, you're on your own for finding out their education levels. All I can tell you is that almost all will have an education ranging from a high school diploma to a PhD. You figure it out. "...Vietnam war, about 30% of the combat troops, ie "grunts", were minorities...." I hate to burst your insulated bubble, but Iraq isn't Vietnam, and this professional military isn't the same military we had in 'Nam.