Silicon Investor (SI) -- The First Internet Community

STOCKTALK

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor. We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community. If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.

Strategies & Market Trends : 2026 TeoTwawKi ... 2032 Darkest Interregnum -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: TobagoJack who wrote (15937)	3/25/2007 3:04:24 AM
From: Maurice Winn	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 218639

TJ, that's not strictly, or even approximately, true: <time is never, ever, with the invaders, because there cannot be sustained will to win > Maoris, to use a close to home example, used to exterminate the male opposition, most of them anyway, keeping some for slavery purposes and as fresh dinner to be consumed later. Lacking refrigeration, they needed to keep them alive like sheep in a paddock. To prevent escape, they would break legs and otherwise incapacitate those kept in the larder. With the opposition all dead or enslaved, that left the women of the enemy to help in producing more of the good Y chromosome to quickly reboost tribal numbers ready for the next genocidal onslaught. Breeding was an imperative around the world when weight of numbers ensured survival in the genocidal wars. In other examples, the USA, Canada and other parts of north and south Americas are full of conquerors from Europe who never were defeated by the local yokels. I don't think Americans will be going "home" any time soon, though many of them like to hyphenate their names as though they have some identity from places of historical interest. We shouldn't forget Genghis and co who did a superlative job of conquest and genetic distribution. Not for several generations did they dwindle back to base, leaving gene pools full of their visitation rights where they went. I note Singapore has a large China/English speaking contingent and I doubt that will change any time soon. Back to NZ, there are 4 million immigrants, another million living offshore and Maoridom is called names like Paul Reeves, Winston Peters, John Delamere ... and looks can range from melanoma prone, to all sorts. Miscegenation is highly popular in NZ. I don't think those immigrants will be going back to their "homes" from where their great grandparents emigrated - it's hard to be in 8 countries at once, even if they would accept the returnee. Half-hearted conquests aren't so successful. See ant wars over cheese studies to determine victory likelihood. Mqurice

To: TobagoJack who wrote (15937)	3/25/2007 3:32:19 AM
From: energyplay	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 218639

Are you considering publishing some excerpts from your grand father's diaries ? ************* >>> "time is never, ever, with the invaders, because there cannot be sustained will to win" Norman Invasion of England. They eventually faded from Sicily, however. The statistical numbers will be on your side if we include anything in the Middle East. The conquest of the Western Hemisphere by Europeans relied on two exceptional items : Large and Expanding disparity in technology and killer epidemics such as smallpox. Also, a certain amount of intermarriage, a traditional weapon of both sides. If we exclude encounters between developed and aboriginal societies, invasion doesn't work well unless the victim country is very small and has few friends. *************** >>>>> "change frame, usa is invading here there and everywhere, now, again, because its people, in the aggregate, want to, nothing more, and will get what is inevitably coming, nothing less" The current administration had to work pretty hard to sell the Iraq invasion, they had to create intelligence findings for Saddam's WMDs and spin the "Al Queda and Iraqis" myth pretty hard. I don't expect the US will be invading anywhere else for a while. I also expect the option of "bomb them back to the stone age from 30,000 feet and NO US BOOTS ON THE GROUND" will be strongly considered in the future.

To: TobagoJack who wrote (15937)	3/25/2007 9:28:42 AM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 218639

had japan gotten hold of the bomb first, is that your then primary language would be japanese, and your then japanese-speaking parliament would also debate whether 13 is the right age consent for teenage girls You mean, like English is the primary language of Japan, and the Japanese Parliament speaks English in session, and the Japanese legal system follows the Common Law? ;^) (For the humor impaired, English is not the primary language of Japan, the Japanese Parliament speaks Japanese in session, and the Japanese legal system does not follow the Common Law.) Similarly, British culture, which is to say American culture, and, for that matter, Kiwi culture, is remarkably resistant to change from outside. We are not assimilated. news.nationalgeographic.com Nor do we have any need to invade countries in order to spread our culture. Take a look around you, and then take a look around the world. (Oh, right, your country was invaded. Sorry about that, it wasn't by us, it was by the Brits. And the Japanese.) The French are an example of cultures which are assimilated. They feel the need to pass special laws to preserve the French language and culture in France and Canada, just to keep from being assimilated. The Japanese, on the other hand . . . . we Americans don't seem to be able to get enough of their culture, especially our young people. Not assimilation, per se. It's sort of like sending out for Chinese take-out, something different for a change.

To: TobagoJack who wrote (15937)	3/25/2007 5:55:29 PM
From: Slagle	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 218639

TJ, About your grandfather, I have a book, "Personal History" by Vincent Sheean, Sheean being an American journalist who liked to immerse himself in exciting circumstances around the world, for the sheer adventure of it and also to obtain material for his magazine and newpaper articles and for his books. Sheean in 1926 attached himself to the "Left Kuomingtang" faction in Hankow, of which your grandfather was chief spokesman and leading personality, and escaped with them to Moscow in 1927. In the book he writes extensively about your grandfather. From page 203: "My interviews were with Borodin and Chen, whose names were best known to the world as the representatives of the point of view of Hankow, of the Left Kuomingtang. Borodin has never sought public attention and disliked giving interviews, but by this time it was no longer possible to avoid them. Eugene Chen loved public attention as a cat loves milk, and was at his best in an interview, rolling forth his grand oratorical sentences with long pauses so that they might be written down in detail. Both Borodin and Chen used English, not only with representatives of the press, but in their communications with each other and with most other members of the Hankow government, for neither had good command of Chinese. Chen was Foreign Minister, the spokesman for all his collegues, as so could freely exercise his gifts as a proclamation monger. Borodin, the chief of the Russian advisers, tried to avoid speaking for the Hankow government." So I think your grandfather was still Foreign Minister of China till at least July, 1927. Sheean was very impressed with your grandfather. From page 206: "Physically and in some of his ways of speech Mr. Chen reminded me of the French politician Malvy: his complacency was like that of Austen Chamberlain; his delight in his own language, and the care he took to see that it was written down in all its baroque magnificence, suggested Mussolini. He was as theatrical as Briand, as ingratiaing as Stresemann, as bitter as Poincare." Quite a fellow, your grandaddy. Months before this Sheean was in Nanking with Chiang Kai-shek, due to a letter of introduction he had been given by T.V. Soong. Here on page 198 is an obersavation about Chiang: "I thought I detected, about his mouth and eyes, one of the rarest human expressions, the look of cruelty." With regards to the cruelty that was common in those days, here he writes, on page 226 about a communist student girl of a rich famly: "One of these girls, we all knew her in Hankow - was disembowelled by Chiang Kai-shek's soliders on June 21st for saying that the Nanking warlord did not represent the party or principles of Sun Yat-sen. Her intestines were taken out while she was alive and wrapped around her body." Sheean states that he was sent back to Shanghai in an attempt to persuade T.V. Soong to come back to Hankow and lend his support to the government, to counter Chiang's defection. They debated for three days and in the end Soong refused. Later he recounts the fall of Hankow and how that all the leadership escaped to Moscow, Sheean being romantically involved with a communist gal from Chicago named Rayna Prohme who was part of Borodin's China mission. "Personal History" was published in 1934 and is a WONDERFUL read, the first half of the book is about his exploits in Spanish Morroco. I see there are a few copies available from Amazon resellers. If you wnat me to find you a copy and send it too you I will be glad to do so. The Sterling Seagrave book "Soong Dynasty" has some references you may find of interest. Seagrave describes how your father and brother escape across Manchuria with Borodin in a Buick car and later how your grandfather and the rest had to stand in the reviewing box in Red Square with the rest of the Bolshevik leadership for endless hours of winter cold while miles and miles of Red Army batallions march by. Also, a more standard biography, "Stillwell and the American Experience in China" by Tuchman has some interesting mentions. The writer relates how in 1926 your grandfather announced his intention to levy taxes on foreigners. Oddly, the most common book on the period, "Thunder Out of China" makes no mention at all of your grandfather. I am a history fanatic and this is my favorite period. <grin> Slagle

To: TobagoJack who wrote (15937)	3/26/2007 6:27:02 PM
From: Cogito Ergo Sum	Respond to of 218639

time is never, ever, with the invaders, because there cannot be sustained will to win One day a hound, out hunting by himself, flushed a hare from a thicket and gave chase. The frightened hare gave the dog a long run and escaped. As the disappointed hound turned back toward home, a passing shepherd said jeeringly, "You’re supposed to be such a fine hunter! Aren’t you ashamed to let a little hare one-tenth your size get the better of you?" :o) "You forget," replied the hound, "that I was only running for my supper, but the hare was running for his life." otoh, to think that the japanese invaders and chiang kaishek could have/would have pacified china in concert against the 400 million of have-nots :o) I cannot help but think that this influences the current leadership... greatly.