Imus is now out of work.
We begin discussing this with Serena Williams, the tennis superstar, multiple major tournament winner. Her sister Venus is also a major tennis star. She was the victim of negative comments on the Imus show by a sports reporter in 2001.
In New York is Ashleigh Banfield, the Court TV anchor who was the target of offensive comments by the former MSNBC host, Michael Savage, when she worked at that network, and she's been a frequent guest on the Imus show.
What was your first reaction to all of this, Serena?
SERENA WILLIAMS, TENNIS STAR: Well, my first reaction was I couldn't really believe that this was actually something that was allowed to be said on air. And not only that, I just think that it was -- these girls had done so well and their efforts to do so well in this championship was -- is kind of overlooked by the comments that Imus said.
KING: But they've come back strong, haven't they?
Those girls now have a tremendous image in this country.
WILLIAMS: They have. They've come back strong. They reacted well. You know, I think they've had some great support and it's good for them to have this good support because, you know, they need it. And they are positive girls and they seem to have positive images. And, most of all, they're really young and you have to imagine someone at this age shouldn't have to withstand such comments.
KING: Ashleigh, what was your first reaction?
ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, COURT TV ANCHOR: Here we go again, unfortunately. And at the same time, I thought I'm sorry for Don Imus. I liked him. I always worked well with him. At the same time, I was disappointed frequently in the things that he said, the way that he said those things.
But I think it's a bigger picture here, Larry. The discourse in cable and on radio is devolving pretty quickly in America. Maybe this is a big check and balance.
KING: Is Imus just what -- could we say -- a very complex person?
BANFIELD: I think to say the least. That would be putting it mildly. I don't think anyone will disagree with that. But you can be complex and you can be acerbic and you can be entertaining. You don't have to cross the line. You don't have to hurt people to the depth that he has.
KING: I'll tell you what happened to Serena. She was the subject of very offensive comments made on the Imus show by Sid Rosenberg during a sports segment in 2001.
Rosenberg, who was the sportscaster for Imus, said the Williams' sisters were too muscular. "They're boys," he said. Rosenberg also said the sisters had a better chance of appearing nude for "National Geographic" than for "Playboy."
What did you think when you heard that?
Now, Imus declared him a moron when he said it, in all fairness to Don.
WILLIAMS: Well, I think, honestly, I don't -- as I've said in most of my interviews, I don't really read the papers and I...
KING: But you knew about this?
WILLIAMS: Yes, obviously I knew about that. But this is the very reason why I don't, is because of comments like this. They're just -- they're really just outrageous. In 2001, at the time, it puts me at, you know, 18, 19 years old. And to take a shot at a teenager is unacceptable and it's just -- quite frankly, it's outrageous.
KING: Michael -- what did Michael Savage, who is outrageous as a radio talk show host, what did he say about you, Ashleigh? And what did the network do?
BANFIELD: He called me a slut and a porn star, and a couple of other choice things, like the accomplice to the killing of Jewish children, I think. And I was watching. I was working at the network at the time. And so I -- my first reaction was I don't think you can say that in the hallway of a workplace to your work colleague, let alone live over the airwaves.
And so I marched down the hall to the president of NBC News at the time, who is no longer there. And I asked for some action. I said an apology, something, anything.
And I was sort of summarily dismissed and told that I was being the equivalent of a nuisance. So nothing happened. Absolutely nothing happened.
And I will say this, Larry, that the first person I encountered in the hallway after that was Steve Capus, who is now the president of NBC News. And he hugged me. He took me into his office and he told me that this was a terrible injustice and it shouldn't have happened.
So I think he is doing something he truly believes in. He believes in his employees and how they feel about this. And I think when he says he canvassed them to ask what he should do, he meant it, and he did.
KING: Serena, do you think these things are said just for shock?
WILLIAMS: You know, I don't think these things are said just for shock. I think these things are said sometimes out of ignorance. Maybe you don't -- they don't really understand what they're saying. And maybe they're just saying it because deep down maybe that's just the way they feel.
But I think it's a little bit of both. I think it's the fact that I'm going to say this comment, but I'm not exactly sure what it means, but it seems cool. It seems -- it seems like it's going to be funny. It seems like it's going to get a laugh. When in all actuality, there's no humor to it at all.
KING: Ashleigh, do you think Michael Savage meant that about you?
BANFIELD: Oh, yes, I do. I think he had a pretty mean spirit. And nothing happened when -- when that was said about me, but just several months later, it took him calling a gay caller -- or telling a gay caller to get AIDS and die for the network to -- to finally take action and fire him.
KING: Really?
He sounds very intelligent.
BANFIELD: Yes. I think you can say that he hasn't had a lot of popularity after those kinds of comments. But, you know, it just goes to show you that, again, some people dance to the line and other people -- other people just bust right through it, like bulls in china shops.
And that's where we have to watch ourselves. I police myself every day on the air. I try to be very careful about what I do. And at the same time, I try to entertain and I try to stimulate and foster interesting conversation and opinion.
But you've got to watch yourself. You've got to be careful. You've got to be respectful.
KING: Serena, do you think this might tend to improve race relations in this country, by just -- by the fact that we're talking about it?
WILLIAMS: You know what?
I think it is. I think it's hard to say. I think this is a step in the right direction. And we, as a people, have come a long ways. And, you know, we're going to continue to try to make those steps forward. And if we were just to sit back and just let anything happen, then, you know, people could continue to make such derogatory comments.
But I think it's important to come out and speak your feelings and talk about it.
KING: We'll take a break and come back. And Serena and Ashleigh will remain with us. And we'll be joined by Bo Dietl, James Carville and the Reverend Al Sharpton. By the way, Sharpton met with the head of CBS today, just before they fired Imus.
Don't go away. |
