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Politics : RAMTRONIAN's Cache Inn -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Norrin Radd who wrote (13453)	7/22/2007 4:51:00 PM
From: happygambler1934	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 14464

<We are 1000 fold LESS SAFE now than before 2001. Any suggestion to the contrary is pure propaganda.> Interesting OPINION...and I respect your and others OPINIONS. Since you flat out submitted your opinion as fact, I supect you have little respect for others opinions. So I guess my opinion is then propaganda. FACTS- 1- Our national interests were attacked numerous times in the 80's and 90's, all act of war. There were at least four(4) major "ACT OF WAR" attacks against our national interests in the 90's, including the WTC bombing which was treated as a civil criminal action. 2- There was one(1) horrible attack against our nation in the 21st century...THAT IS ONE(1). There have been none since then, and many have been thwarted. So my "propaganda" opinion, based on the facts, is that we are safer now than on September 10, 2001. Now you can let your political hatred try to alter those facts....I'll let history be the judge of our finally taking up arms against an uncivilized barbaric ideology, and whether our nation finally turned the other cheek(s) too many times. HAP

To: Norrin Radd who wrote (13453)	7/22/2007 7:02:10 PM
From: jimtracker1	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 14464

As long as you have congress trying to pull the strings ie Harry Reid, and Nancy Pelosi and administration trying to cover its ass it requires the military to do combat on more than just the middle east. My former next door neighbor was a marine colonel who just went to work for Blackwater. Down the street are two more colonels. One a POW in Germany after he bombed the crap out of it. The one at the end of the street was Vietnam era who just welcomed his two sons home from Iraq. My uncle Taft was an Admiral. SO WHAT? And Kerry had a General Discharge! Disagreement with higher ups is a military trait. However now with news 24/7 and around the world in seconds you have a PR war also. Remember this, any High Ranking officer who is not in Iraq or Afghanistan is suspect. Read more history. Wars start for a variety of reasons, some very stupid. Roosevelt cut off the flow of scrap steel and oil to Japan. Japan was starving to death. They needed more land and if it just had oil reserves all the better. This brought on by the rape of Nanking and the continuing hatred by the Chinese for the Japanese. MacArthur and Truman, Douglas thought Harry was an idiot. Roosevelt had to deal with British General Montgomery who knew everything. Oh yah, Roosevelt failed to warn Pearl Harbor that they were about to be attacked but that sure as hell ended the great depression. The most knowledgeable comment came from Eisenhower when he cautioned "beware of the growing, industrial military complex". Wars bring prosperity always have. Look how we rebuilt Japan and Germany. Poverty creates a world petri dish that grows an environment of hate and contempt.. The world Hates us now. Well no shit Sherlock. They have always hated us. Are you naive enough to think this is because of Bush? Do you think I love the Germans? They used to call me a "fucking Chicago gangster", to my face and I was from Utah. My friend who fought in the Pacific won't buy a Japanese car. The Germans have hated us since WW1. The french hate everybody and have been some of the cruelest in victory. No Wmds? We had bad intelligence. You can blame that on the Senator from Idaho, Frank Church, a red democrat who thought the world should know the names of our spies and where they lived. Thousands were murdered and our intelligence then came from pronouncements of our opponents, paid fabricators, and the press. This set our intelligence back 30 years. This is not the first time we have fought Arabs. GROW UP. It takes at least 2 generations to forgive and forget and in the meantime another war starts and the clock starts running from one again. You may think we were 1000 fold less safe now that before 2001. You just were not aware of how bad it is outside our country and obviously did not care enough to find out what was over the next hill. The Jews have been fighting our battles for years. They fight for their lives and the lives of their children. We fight till the next election. Hell of a way to fight a world war. Here is something to think about. The Germans invented the flame thrower and everyone used them until this war. I guess that is not a humane way to kill someone. I was trained to kick in a door, then throw in a fragmentation grenade and after it exploded to shoot everything that moved. Now they kick in a door, throw is a flash grenade (the same ones the police use) then check to see if there is more than one AK47 per male. The rules of engagement now are such as to keep the press happy. Not the safety of our troops. On Omaha beach we lost about 2500 men dead, with another 9000 wounded in one day.I served with some of those men. Do you know what they remember? The surf was red with blood. In the middle east, 3500 dead of our troops is a miracle. I don't give a damn how many Iraqi's, Syrians, or others die. WE DID NOT START THIS WAR. I would turn that Valley between Afghanistan and Pakistan into soot and save our men. But people like you who have not had a shot fired over your head would scream liked a wounded mule. Incidentally, when a bullet goes by your head it snaps. Worry more about the 25 violent deaths every week in Los Angeles. You can complain about that. You have not paid the price to condemn the goings on in Iraq nor have I. Wars are always a comedy of errors but thank God, the USA does not have a lock on it. You have talked to a General, wow, a messiah, wow, a man of vast knowledge wow. They all go through the same war colleges, they all go through the same training but being here in the states they are safe and not exposed. Hell the drones are flown from Edwards AFB in California. My last words. When I got my Sgt stripes, the 1st Sgt said to me, if you lose one man, I will make you regret the fact that that one man was not you. Don't fuck up. I will just imagine when your General got his 3rd star, his comment was "the drinks are on me". How many silver, or bronze stars did he have? How many purple hearts? Now that gives him credence.