Silicon Investor (SI) -- The First Internet Community

STOCKTALK

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor. We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community. If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.

Politics : A US National Health Care System? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Road Walker who wrote (2242)	10/31/2007 10:04:05 PM
From: Lazarus_Long	Respond to of 42652

Well you seldom see passenger cars running on railroad tracks, so you have a more limited usage don't you. And you seldom see railroad trains delivering goods to main street businesses. Seems to me they are complimentary. I've never seen a passenger car hauling 100 tons of freight. Have you? Complimentary, my **! You are starting to catch on...* Doing much better than you then, apparently. You JUST HAPPENED to cut out a piece of argument you lost and that you are going to have to answer: YOU: "Insurance isn't a typical industry; it's essentially legalized gambling. That's why it is one of the most regulated industries as it should be." ME: Buying potatoes or paper clips for resale is gambling, John. You're gambling that you can sell them for more than you paid. So should ALL business and industry be regulated? ALL of it is gambling by YOUR definition. Why do you think they call Wall Street "the other Las Vegas"? The superiority of Private/Public isn't the point. Public is efficient and fair as I said. So it's fair that geniuses be held back to the pace of dolts? Superiority ISN'T the point? You better take a look at our competitors, socialist, while there's still time. It IS the point. Screw FAIR. You can't even define it in in away any majority would agree on. Can you prove more money poured into education produces better results? If not, why do it? So. I don't have kids and have been paying property insurance most of my life. That's fixable. You have a child tax you pay for each child. \|You have no kids, you don't pay. The proceeds go into a common fund, from which are issued vouchers that go to parents that can only be used for a child's education. And I'd say that eets the "fair" test. You may never have a house fire but you pay for the Fire Department. You do so effectively at gunpoint. It's called society... invented by the caveman. Working together for our mutual benefit... even some wild pack animals understand the concept. No one said you couldn't buy fire and liability insurance. Can't pay claims resulting from a fire starting on your property? Off to jail. The point is single payer would be more efficient and less expensive Than a gov't bureaucracy? Are you SERIOUS???? HAVE YOU EVER TALKED TO ANYONE ON MEDICARE ABOUT THE BATTLES THEY HAVE TO GET SLIGHTLY OUT-OF-THE-ORDINARY but legitimate medical expenses paid? You that person the doc has in a back room figuring out codes for illnesses and procedures for the insurance claims? Well, YOU'RE that person under Medicare! 100%. And they don't pay their adjusters commissions based on denied claims. You have proof they do so now? Unlikely. The most likely model is Medicare for everyone. We can't afford the Medicare we have. How do you propose expanding it enormously? How do you pa for it? That is, without waiting lines that drive the desperately and painfully ill out of the country to get care? cbo.gov Medicare in 2006 cost $909B. The usual eligibility age is 65. ebri.org 12.6% of the population is over that age. cia.gov A quick and dirty calc says Medicare for all would cost $7.2T. That roughly half of the US GDP! But we know that is high. Sickness and need for health care goes up with age, particularly towards the end of life. Roughly half of lifetime medical expenditures will be in the last year of life as doctors struggle to keep you alive against multiple failing systems and organs. The distribution of expenses by type of service varied substantially by age (figure 5). Hospital inpatient expenses comprised 39.9 percent of expenses for persons age 65 and over compared to 28.1 percent for adults age 18-64 and 20.8 percent for children under 18. Compared to adults, a substantially smaller share of total expenses for children under 18 was for prescribed medicines (11.9 versus 20.3-20.7 percent). Conversely, a substantially larger share of children’s expenses was for dental services (22.7 percent) than for adults age 18-64 (7.7 percent) or 65 and over (3.1 percent). Expenses for emergency room care comprised a fairly small share of total expenses in all age groups, but accounted for a higher proportion of total spending for children (6.5 percent) than adults. Health care expenses are paid by individuals and third-party payers, such as private insurance and public programs. In 2004, private insurance covered 42.8 percent of the total expenses; individuals and family members paid 19.0 percent out of pocket; Medicare paid 20.9 percent; and Medicaid paid 10.6 percent (figure 6). While the proportions paid out of pocket were fairly similar across age groups, shares paid by public and private sources varied considerably. For example, private insurance paid for over half of expenses for persons under 65 years of age, but only 16.7 percent of expenses for persons age 65 and over. Conversely, Medicare paid for over half of expenses (54.5 percent) for persons age 65 and over versus only a negligible proportion for younger persons. Moreover, the proportion of expenses paid by Medicaid for children under 18 (22.6 percent) was about twice that for adults age 18-64 (11.7 percent) and four times that for persons age 65 and over (5.5 percent). meps.ahcpr.gov 20.9% paid by Medicare? Then our factor should be 5, rather than 8. $4.5T. About 1/3 of current GDP. research.stlouisfed.org THAT'S MORE THAN 4X CURRENT FEDERAL RECEIPTS! research.stlouisfed.org WHERE are you going to get the money? I thought you guys were frying Bush for deficit spending! A single payment system, rather than 2000 payment systems saves a lot of money on both the payment and collection ends. You take out the high profits and salaries of the health insurance companies. I see. You get your kidney dialysis from DMV. No thanks.