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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: one_less who wrote (247213)	11/2/2007 3:46:32 PM
From: Lou Weed	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Great post gem.......

To: one_less who wrote (247213)	11/3/2007 1:00:35 AM
From: cnyndwllr	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 281500

Rough Cut, re: We are continuing the struggle and once again, not as a war of conquest but one to see what will rule at the end of the day, tyranny or liberty. .... Our government believes the struggle against extremists and tyrannical regimes is worth it and that the people living under those conditions want for their children, what the mothers of American children want for their children… peaceful coexistence and autonomy in their lives. At least that is what George Bush has said, and I am convinced he believes it. We're really fighting a great battle for liberty versus tyranny? And we're fighting it on behalf of other people who want for their children what we want for ours? And that's the either/or choice? And George Bush said it and you believe it? Damn man, get a clue. Liberty comes when a culture, a people and a nation demand it. It doesn't come when YOU missionary types think it's time they ought to have it. And they have to do more than demand it; they have to want it badly enough so that a strong majority of them stand up to fight and die for it. And, even after they achieve some semblance of liberty, it won't endure unless their culture has adopted mores that incorporate a deep and abiding respect for the rule of law, the rights of minorities living among them and institutions that check and balance the power of the most powerful among them. These are things that that can't be "handed" to them. In the ancient cultures of the middle east these things can't occur in a year, or a decade, or maybe even a generation; these things change gradually over time. And during that time they'll try lots of other things that the strong dogs over there think they want. That's how cultures learn. Look around you, look at history and look at our experience in Iraq and the facts are right in front of your face. But you won't see it because you have too much pride in your "white knight" image of yourself as a gallant crusader for freedom. So why is it that most of the entire world, and a huge majority of the people you want to "help" are telling you to get your ass out of their country and let them be? They've got lots to say but like all missionary personalities, you think you know better, you're ignoring what they're telling you with words and actions and you're cheer leading the effort to save them from themselves. Real life doesn't reward that kind of busybody intervention. But like a record that keeps skipping back to the same chorus, you just keep coming back to the same clueless slogan. And all the while our soldiers are killing and dying and our volunteer army withers away. Ed