To: arun gera who wrote (25022 ) 11/10/2007 5:09:04 PM From: Maurice Winn Respond to of 217765 Within the serfdom world of state-run tribalism kleptocracies, there are pockets of capitalism. Children can still run lemonade stands in some countries without Big Brother bossing them around [though they are now under attack too for health and safety reasons and to ensure the tax net is not breached]. That's easy: <Are there free markets for labor? Why is a human being not allowed to take up a job anywhere? Why is he discriminated based on where he or she was born or to whom he/she was born? > To some extent there are free markets for "labour"; labour is an odd word in the modern world where thinking is more normal than labour. But governments increasingly decide hiring and firing practices, which reduces the value and hence pay of workers. Hiring somebody is a risky thing to do these days [in NZ] because the employee then owns the company and they can't be fired without loads of compensation, litigation and bureaucracy. A job is seen as a property right, which is very weird thinking. The reason humans are not allowed to be hired anywhere is because they also live there, using the property of the collective to which they didn't contribute. Me and my ancestors and other NZers have worked for centuries to build the assets of NZ, including my house. I don't want a swarm of people moving into my house, roads, hospitals, schools, airports and taking over my water, electricity, sewerage, spectrum and everything else which has been created - certainly not if they haven't paid for it. If they were to pay the market price for it all, then I'd be delighted for them to move in. But there is no market price because governments run serfdom collectivist operations instead of tradeable citizenships. I discriminate against people based on who they are, who their parents are, where they were born etc because I don't want just anyone taking over my property. If I just leave the front door open for anyone to move in, help themselves to the refrigerator, water, electricity etc, my lifestyle will suffer dramatically. I provided my house for me, my family, and those I choose to have here. Using the word "discriminate" is supposed to show I'm a meanie for not just handing over my things to any bludger who shows up. Too bad. Call me a racist too and that would be right because I do give my family different treatment from other races. My race is allowed to live in my house. You are quite right that freedom is only as allowed within the limited space allowed marauding megalomaniacs running their state serfdoms. But some political systems are more liberal than others. Stalinist and Maoistic mania is NOT free. Zimbabwe is not free. Hong Kong is more free. Bermuda is more free. If Ron Paul becomes the USA president, there will be more freedom than if another wins. Not a lot more, because Congress is the boss and the Supreme Court creates repressive laws out of thin air too. Electorates can choose more or less freedom and it's fascinating how they invariably prefer not much freedom at all. Humans like to be bossed around and have alpha males rule them. They flock to any charlatan religious figure to give them [and their daughters] "guidance" while demanding cash for such services. They fawn over celebrities. They sing Hail to the chief. They chant Seig Heil. They march in goose-step. Libertarians get little support anywhere. Mqurice PS: Microsoft, Google and Yahoo! didn't think they were free. They have always been well aware that they are stuck within confiscatory repressive states. < Free is what the State allows you to think you are. > It's not what you think, it's what they allow. One can still think anything one likes. It's an ignorant person who thinks they are free anywhere, other than in certain ways. <Free is what Microsoft thought it was, before it was put in place by the State and now the European Union. Free is what yahoo and google are pretending to be, and then they bow down to the dominant states - China or US. >