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Politics : Politics for Pros- moderated -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Rambi who wrote (230946)	12/8/2007 7:40:22 PM
From: Brumar89	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 793877

My friend attended years ago- The stuff I posted included comments from people who had attended 20 years. They explicitly said there was no change from then to now. I believe that testimony. And she also said children should NOT be there. Its a shame the police and child welfare departments in SF don't agree. I don't honestly know how to respond to the statement about what the gay movement wants to "change" in society. None of the gays or lesbians we know are advocating for that kind of life style or would approve of it: they are businessmen, lawyers, church musicians, who live the same way we do- in monogamous relationships and exhibiting responsible behaviors. I figure SF is ground zero for the gay rights movement and what they have there is what the movement wants. I'm sure there are individual gay people who disagree, but they arent driving the movement. it's such a weapon for the anti-gay groups. Yes, it is. All the more reason the movement should take a position against such things. They have the power in SF to do something. But they don't. In fact, they create the environment which allows children, even a 9 year old leaving church, to witness gay sex on the street. Why not admit the obvious? But it's no more accurate than saying that all Muslims are terrorists But its accurate to say the Taliban supports terrorists because they allowed AQ to operate freely in their country. And its accurate to say the gay rights movement has a controlling influence in SF and approves of the way things are run there ... beyond that they are a big reason why things are run there the way they are. Gay parents are not all child abusers, or even poor parents, going by the evidence in thus far on children raised in gay or lesbian homes, and certainly all gays aren't into the D-S or S&M subcultures. I have no idea of the percentage, but bet it's not that high. I haven't said all gays are child abusers, poor parents, or into S&M. I do think the liberal gay rights proponents who run SF value gay self-expression more than child protection. And the facts bear that out. I am not sure, incidentally, whether you could make the case for child abuse with this. I know what you and I believe, but it might be hard to prove. Particularly with toddlers, who may have no clue what they were seeing, and who may be well-cared for and loved by all other appearances. First, there were more than the two toddlers. The article cited a ten year old, my post cited the testimony of a fellow who was 9 and a mother who said she took her child in a stroller, and accounts of various teenage attendees. So kids going is apparently pretty common. Second the business about it being hard to prove .... well I disagree. If someone took kids to a strip club or porno theater and said "prove they were watching", I'd consider that a pretty weak argument. Tough one to try to take to court. In San Francisco, yes. No problem most other places. JMO Compared to some of the cases I've worked with in Child Protective Services, this would be farther down the "worst cases I have seen" list. Well, yeah. Kids are killed sometimes. This is mild compared to that. But still ...