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Politics : Just the Facts, Ma'am: A Compendium of Liberal Fiction -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: tejek who wrote (63623)	1/24/2008 2:44:56 PM
From: TimF	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 90947

Again your making irrelevant arguments. and you keep defending their criminal activity. No its incompetence, or just mistake making, not criminal activity. There are of course a few cases of actual criminal activity, but there have also been government officials who where criminals. In any case what your describing (large bonuses while the stock tanks) isn't a crime. More importantly I'm not defending it, just pointing out that rewards for mistakes and causing problems are more likely in government than in the private sector (at least when the government doesn't try to "protect" the private sector from competition). Stocks going down, companies failing etc. is how the private sector reallocates capital to more efficient use. You focus on two things 1 - The pain of this change, and 2 - The small portion of the money skimmed off the top. Well sure the change is painful but if you try to stop it you leave the resources mis-allocated and lose the much larger benefits of capitalism. See Message 24239641 As for money skimmed off the top - 1 - Actual skimming off the top is the exception not the rule. High salaries, bonuses and wages of CEOs are negotiated compensation for services not theft. 2 - Paying CEOs a lot often makes. His decisions can gain or destroy far more value than his salary. See these posts - Message 24154688 Message 24238577 Message 23240026 Message 23594274 Also - "Some of us still believe that the worth of a CEO should be determined by stockholders rather than the President of the United States." David Harsanyi, author of The Nanny State, is worried about the expanded role of government that Hillary Clinton proposes: According to the New York Times, Hillary Clinton says that if she becomes president the federal government will take a more active role in the economy “to address what she called the excesses of the market and of the Bush administration.” Scary stuff for anyone who still believes in the free market. I agree--scary stuff. What's next? Holding wages down on those people she deems make too much money, taxing the daylights out of those who are successful? What will become of a country that rewards doing poorly with tax rebates and penalizes those who are successful with higher taxes? You get more of what you reward... drhelen.blogspot.com 3 - The total paid out to CEOs is insignificant compared to the wealth created by the free markets and creative destruction that I'm talking about. Even if it is an issue to be concerned about when addressed directly and on the proper scale, its not a response to the points I have been raising. The subprime debacle in which several foreign banks were snookered into buying makes the US look third world. Nonsense. Either you don't care about the truth or you are very ignorant about the third world. It might account for why the US is becoming less and less a destination for global investment dollars. More nonsense unless your just fixated on short term fluctuations.

To: tejek who wrote (63623)	1/27/2008 3:03:35 PM
From: Lazarus_Long	Respond to of 90947

As J. P. Morgan said when asked what would happen to the market as he was embarking on a cruise to Europe, "It will fluctuate." You didn't know this? finance.yahoo.com GE has only 2/3 of the value it had in 2000. Is Immelt a criminal? Dupont has lost almost half its value? finance.yahoo.com Is Holliday a criminal? GM is a quarter of its high. finance.yahoo.com Is Wagoner a criminal? Citigroup is down to 50% of its peak. Are Sandy Weill and Robert Rubin criminals? finance.yahoo.com Home Dpot id down 2/3 from its peaks. Are all its ececs criminals? finance.yahoo.com Would you care to produce proof of any of your charges? Or are you so stupid you couldn't recognize a bubble when it hit you and didn't have the smarts to jump? Stop blaming other people for your own failures. Study and learn from your mistakes. That won't be the last opportunity.