SI
SI
discoversearch

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor.  We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community.  If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.
Politics : Stockman Scott's Political Debate Porch -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: stockman_scott who wrote (77809)6/1/2008 11:32:35 AM
From: longnshort  Respond to of 89467
 
Clinton's backers: We won't 'roll over'
Sean Lengell (Contact)
Sunday, June 1, 2008

The Democratic Party risks the defection of many supporters of Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton unless it settles the Florida and Michigan primary fracas to their satisfaction, said protesters at pro-Clinton rallies in Washington yesterday.

"I refuse to be associated with a party that is stupid, self-destructive and undemocratic, and now, I'm beginning to realize, is misogynistic," said Norma Broude, an American University professor who was among more than 1,000 Clinton supporters at a "count the vote" rally at Rock Creek Park.

Friend and fellow American University professor Mary Garrard agreed, saying that she will not vote for Mrs. Clinton's rival, Sen. Barack Obama, if he receives the party's presidential nomination.

"The Democratic Party has disdained the female demographic, they have demeaned Hillary Clinton, and this time we're not going to roll over," Ms. Garrard said.


As the pro-Clinton contingent, which was largely female but racially and generationally mixed, rallied in the park, Democratic leaders were gathered a few blocks away at the Marriott Wardman Park Hotel to decide the fate of the combined 313 disqualified delegates from Florida and Michigan, and, in turn, the fate of Mrs. Clinton's long-shot chance of overcoming Mr. Obama's delegate lead.
Brightcove Video

Democratic leadership disqualified the delegates and barred them from attending the party's August convention in Denver as punishment for the states moving their primaries ahead of Feb. 5 - a violation of party rules. They decided last night to award half-votes to each state's delegates and apportion the delegates to the two candidates in a ratio that did not satisfy the Clinton team.

Rod Lamkey Jr./The Washington Times Marsha Deane, of Alexandria, pumps her fist, while David Petrella, of Cleveland, waves the American flag outside the Marriott Wardman Park Hotel, as the Democratic National Committee's Rules and Bylaws panel meets to consider the seating of Florida and Michigan delegations.

Mrs. Clinton, who has virtually no chance of winning the nomination without major boosts from those states, has pushed hard for full delegations to be reinstated. She won both contests, although her rival removed his name from the Michigan ballot. Both candidates also agreed not to campaign in either state.

As the committee announced its decisions, Clinton supporters in the room angrily shouted "Count all the votes!" and "This isn't fair!"

"This is not the Democratic Party. The Republicans are the ones that disenfranchise the voters," shouted one man while thrusting his fist in the air.

"You stripped me of my vote. How dare you," shouted a woman from the balcony.After the meeting adjourned, Clinton backer Michele Thomas accused Democratic leaders of "fixing" the primary results in favor of Mr. Obama, and said she will leave the party.

"The Democratic Party turned its back on us, and now we're going to turn our backs on them," said Ms. Thomas, who traveled from her home in Los Angeles to attend the hearing.


Polls of Democratic primary voters also suggest that many Clinton supporters would not support Mr. Obama in November against the Republican nominee-in-waiting Sen. John McCain.

Surveys of Clinton voters in recent primary states have shown that 26 percent to 36 percent, depending on the state, say they would back Mr. McCain over Mr. Obama in the general election, while just 10 percent to 18 percent of Obama supporters say they would prefer the Republican to the other Democrat in November.

Elaine Fenwick, of Bend, Ore., makes clear her position on the issue, which has divided supporters of Democratic presidential rivals Sens. Hillary Rodham Clinton and Barack Obama.

Gallup tracking reports from May 23 through May 28 showed Mrs. Clinton consistently running three to five percentage points ahead of Mr. McCain. Over the same period, Mr. Obama fared no better than a tie with the Republican senator.

"Hillary is obviously better positioned to beat McCain than Obama," Ms. Garrard said.

Constanta Nour-Hinkle of Reading, Pa., who was one of a few hundred Clinton supporters who protested outside the Marriott, said she is a lifelong Democrat, but would not vote for Mr. Obama for president.

"It would be the first time in my life I would vote Republican for president," said Mrs. Nour-Hinkle, 35. "I think Obama is an empty shirt, the same as [President] George W. Bush, but only a Democrat."


John Overton, who shouted pro-Clinton slogans outside the hotel, said he would leave the party if Mr. Obama receives the Democratic nomination for president.

"I can't stand for the Democratic Party if they don't stand for voters' rights," said Mr. Overton, who traveled from his home in Chapel Hill, N.C., to attend the rally. The party "would no longer exist to me as a party."

"I don't scream like this normally. I'm a rational guy, but I've never felt like this before," he added. "This has been a travesty of democracy."



To: stockman_scott who wrote (77809)6/1/2008 11:54:19 AM
From: longnshort  Respond to of 89467
 
the dems are losing 1000s of voters by the hour.

youtube.com



To: stockman_scott who wrote (77809)6/1/2008 12:26:15 PM
From: longnshort  Respond to of 89467
 
>Fears grow that Obama can't win

--Analysts believe white working class Democrats will defect to McCain if Clinton is not the nominee

Paul Harris in New York
The Observer, Sunday June 1 2008

With senator Barack Obama poised this week to clinch his party's nomination for President, there are growing fears in some quarters that the Democratic party may not be choosing its strongest candidate to beat Republican John McCain.

Senator Hillary Clinton has been making that argument for weeks. Now some recent polls and analysis, looking particularly at vital battleground states and support among white voters, have bolstered her case - even as Obama looks certain to become the nominee.

Obama supporters reject this argument and point to his record of boosting Democratic voter turnout, especially among the young. But sceptics in the party, already nervous about nominating Obama after the furore over outspoken pastor Jeremiah Wright, are growing increasingly concerned. 'There is an element of buyer's remorse in some areas. The question is whether it gets really strong now or in September - or even after the election is over, if he loses,' said Steve Mitchell, head of political consultancy Mitchell Research.

Another boost to Clinton's case came late last week after a pro-Obama preacher gave a race-tinged rant against her at Obama's church in Chicago. In a recent sermon Michael Pfleger - a long-term Obama backer who is white - mocked Clinton as an entitled white person angry at a black man having beaten her. His angry, red-faced speech, in which he mimicked Clinton weeping, was played repeatedly across American cable channels and the internet.

The news sent shock waves through Democratic circles; many had hoped Obama had put 'pastor problems' behind him. 'It is more of the same problem as Wright. It reinforces the image among some voters that Obama does not share their values,' said Mitchell.

The uproar also lent a disturbingly antagonistic tone to scenes in Washington DC where Clinton and Obama supporters gathered yesterday outside a party rules meeting called to resolve the problem of the disputed Michigan and Florida primaries, which Clinton claims as victories. Clinton supporters chanted 'Count our votes!' and waved placards and banners. Clinton wants those states' delegations seated at the Denver convention, even though they broke party rules by holding early contests.

Obama is now to some extent limping to the finishing line. Clinton's refusal to bow out even though her odds of victory have become almost impossible has seen her win several of the most recent contests. In fact, since 4 March, Clinton has won around half a million more votes than Obama. That run of victories should easily continue today when Puerto Rico goes to the polls, and could even extend to the final primaries - South Dakota and Montana - which vote on Tuesday. Obama had been expected to win there, but Clinton has been campaigning furiously and it could be close.

Clinton has been making the case for several months, as her support has grown stronger among white working class voters, that those voters will not support Obama in a general election. By contrast, experts believe Obama's core - educated Democrats and blacks - will remain loyal to the party no matter who the nominee is. There is strong data to back that up, especially from recent votes in West Virginia and Kentucky where large proportions of Clinton voters said they would not back Obama in November.

There is also a growing fear that many of the women backing Clinton are turning against Obama. Clinton and her supporters have controversially accused their rival, and the media, of being misogynistic in the last few weeks of the race. A recent Pew Poll showed Obama's support among white women collapsing from 56 per cent to 43 per cent.

But the electoral fact remains the same. The dramatic Obama vs Clinton contest is now down to a few hundred uncommitted party 'superdelegates', who are under huge pressure to make their decisions in the next few days. Senior party figures, including House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, have been working privately to convince them to make that decision as soon as possible, ideally this week. With Obama's delegate lead unassailable, the vast majority are almost certain to come over to his side.

Republican analysts, meanwhile, are surprised about how healthy their party's prospects look in a year when almost all indicators suggested they should lose. McCain remains competitive against Obama. He even leads in some key states. Indeed, some research predicts he could romp home against Obama.

It is that prospect, Clinton supporters say, that leads them to keep fighting. They point to Obama's performance in North Carolina as a bellwether: it was his strong win there earlier this month that dealt an almost fatal blow to Clinton's chances. Yet, two weeks after that win, polls showed Clinton easily outperformed Obama there when measured against McCain. 'Clinton has a very strong argument that she is a stronger candidate against McCain. It is just that it has fallen on deaf ears,' said Mitchell.



To: stockman_scott who wrote (77809)6/1/2008 4:40:52 PM
From: longnshort  Respond to of 89467
 
Obama now has lost like 7 of the last 9 primaries. For the leading candidate that can't be a good omen.



To: stockman_scott who wrote (77809)6/1/2008 6:39:53 PM
From: longnshort  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 89467
 
Obama will lose 11 of the last 13 dem primaries, he can't even win against dems.