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To: Elroy Jetson who wrote (70110)	8/4/2008 2:32:17 PM
From: Snowshoe	Respond to of 74559

True, but expanding the market for gas may result in lots of gas supply coming on line. Right now there's lots of political noise about developing oil in ANWR, but the oil is just a side show. The Arctic is loaded with natural gas and methane hydrates. So if the market can induce pipeline construction from Alaska and the MacKenzie Delta, we would have some very secure and long-term supplies. People in the USA are really tired of depending on insecure oil supplies from places lie the MidEast, Russia, Nigeria, Venezuela, etc.

To: Elroy Jetson who wrote (70110)	8/5/2008 10:41:45 AM
From: Maurice Winn	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 74559

How are refineries supposed to get rid of muck from the bottom of cat crackers, dead rats, cats, catalyst, yard sweepings, used engine oil, municipal waste, demolition materials and sustainably recycled tyres if they can't chop them up into bunker fuel? <Beginning in July 1, 2009 California will require ships to use cleaner fuel than bunker fuel when they are within 32 miles of California. This alone will eliminate 11% of the particulate emissions in Los Angeles. > Joking aside, it used to seem absurd that in Los Angeles, there were very strict rules on catalytic converters and smog controls on cars while dirty great trucks and buses would be roaring past with clouds of gunk pouring out their chimneys. One truck was the equivalent of about 10,000 old cars. There was just about enough goop in the air that cars could have operated just on the air without bothering with fuel via the fuel tank. In some timber processing factories, there is enough dust that a dust cloud fire can get going. osh.dol.govt.nz There's probably a good business to be had sucking in air, separating and collecting the particulates, using them as fuel. Or maybe just use the fuel/air mixture as is, with a bit of topping up on clean air days. China's exports of goop in the air must be substantial these days, forming a significant part of the particulates in California. Mqurice