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To: energyplay who wrote (39235)	8/25/2008 7:52:48 AM
From: Webster Groves	Respond to of 217818

<But now, they are running out of stupid> Peak stupid ?? That will be a hard sell. wg

To: energyplay who wrote (39235)	8/25/2008 8:02:03 AM
From: dvdw©	Respond to of 217818

Aluminum cost is mostly electricity. But it's a sure bet someone will start pushing a "peak aluminum" theory...and getting to do research. new technology is coming here too.....research suggests that some new methodologies will cut energy needed by 40%......that is big.

To: energyplay who wrote (39235)	8/25/2008 9:05:32 AM
From: elmatador	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 217818

Metals/materials equation has changed. It was about mine where ore was available, ship to smelter near consumer/end user. 40 years ago changes started. Japan farmed out Aluminium after first oil shock since it imported Bauxite and energy to smelter it. Iron is following aluminium in a similar manner. Vale mines iron ore, ThyssenKrupp smelter it Rio, ship steel to Alabama and to Germany to be transformed into special steel for auto markers. All that based in shipping costs and proximity of mines here in Brazil. But ThyssenKrupp in Rio is an integrated with electricity, cement and Oxygen company Air Liquide all coupled with the main plant. That is the shape of things to come.