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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Katelew who wrote (82794)	9/7/2008 4:27:09 PM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541556

Katelew, I happen to be a biologist. I think that most religious laws (and non-religious laws) arise out of social evolution. That still isn't an objective standard. I really don't know what we're arguing about. Societies have religions or laws that criminalize behaviors because they aren't productive. If you have a society where there is no murder, killing is going to become a bit of a problem. Almost all societies develop laws about killing- what kind is ok, what is not (and there's a lot of variation in this- which was my point about no objective standard), and what you do if you DO kill someone (many of these laws involve elaborate "revenge" rituals, sometimes involving blood money.) I am not stuck on religious people trying to circumvent anyone's enjoyment. I have no idea how you got that from what I said. Let me suggest to you that I look at this as an evolutionary biologist would- which is exactly the same way I look at religion. Clearly I hit some sort of nerve. It was not intentional. I'm not religious, and I have no idea what feelings might be hurt by what I say. I can only see it the way I see it- which is that there are no objective moral laws, and that the solutions men find to make a society develop around their religions, and what is aesthetically pleasing to the society- and the aesthetic changes over time, so it's very clear it's not a fixed point, but an ever changing one (even for the religious- witness that Christians no longer heed the penalties the bible suggests for certain "crimes").

To: Katelew who wrote (82794)	9/7/2008 4:37:35 PM
From: neolib	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 541556

What you'll find are common sense suggestions that serve to protect people from harming themselves or others. Depends on whether you are looking at trees or the forest. The forest of much of the O.T. is about ethnic conquest and genocide, as commanded by God. That story still plays out today in the M.E. and has much resonance with Evangelical Christians in the USA. The trees of the Ten Commandments paint a different picture, one which would agree pretty much with your statement above, and some of Christ's teaching in the N.T. would do even better IMO.