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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Lane3 who wrote (92240)	10/28/2008 1:39:42 PM
From: cnyndwllr	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541659

Lane, I understand your concerns but the issue far too complex to be analyzed as a simple "sponge off others" question. If you phrase the issue as a spongers question, it answers itself. As the questions John asked you reveal, however, almost all of us, including you, approve of some form of assistance when it either supports a greater good for the larger population or alleviates an intolerable situation for any one of us. I think the difference between your view on the one hand, and my view and probably John's view on the other, is that we're making a vastly different assumption with respect to the circumstances and mind set of the "spongers." My view is that many of those who are not providing for themselves have virtually no valid options other than to "sponge," while I suspect your view is that many of them are greedily choosing to live off the taxpayers largesse. My view is based on the opinion that our economy has left many "workers" behind so that they are unable to earn a decent living wage that will allow them to feed, shelter, clothe and provide medical care for themselves and their family. I think technology has mechanized our society to the point where those on the west end of the bell curve are forced to compete for the too few jobs that are available for their vast numbers. I think that creates a horribly demeaning and spirit killing reality for them. I think that, like the girl at the high school dances that never gets asked, eventually they give up hope and go home. I think that's human nature. And I think it's going to get worse. It amazes me when Obama talks about affording everyone the opportunity to go to college. The bottom 10% of the bell curve aren't going to go to college and even if you paid them to go, they aren't going to get a college requisite job. So what are you going to do with those who cannot successfully run the income race? Because we're empathetic and moralistic, our society simply won't let Darwin's theory weed them and their progeny out through disease, starvation and neglect. So, as a practical matter, we fill the gap between what they can earn, if anything, and the standard of living that we consider minimally acceptable. But, ultimately, I also share your concerns about creating a rights-based entitlement system for those who cannot make a decent living. And I agree with your suggestion that it's better to redistribute money by creating jobs. For those who can work but simply can't secure a decent job, that solution at least allows them the dignity of work and, as an added plus, it keeps the true spongers honest. Finally, you write; "People will vote for those who take money from others and give it to them." That's true but don't forget that at least an equal number of us will not vote for those who take money from us and give it to others. It's those of us in the middle who can be convinced. You'll hate my saying this but the dividing line is fairness. Most of us will vote for someone who allocates our tax dollars to the needy, but only if they can convince us that it goes to the truly needy, that the amount is reasonable and that we're all contributing a fair amount. Ed