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Politics : Stockman Scott's Political Debate Porch -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Knighty Tin who wrote (78604)	11/19/2008 11:35:39 AM
From: longnshort	Respond to of 89467

So a couple of months ago dems in congress had Oil Execs. and said you are making money, profits. We are gonna punish you. Now they have auto execs and say you are losing money we will reward you. I don't think the dems get it

To: Knighty Tin who wrote (78604)	11/19/2008 1:14:25 PM
From: stockman_scott	Respond to of 89467

Wilbur Ross Says GM Bankruptcy Filing Would Be a `Total Mess' By Mike Ramsey Nov. 14 (Bloomberg) -- Investor Wilbur Ross, who made billions turning around distressed steel and textile companies, said a Chapter 11 filing by General Motors Corp. or another U.S. automaker wouldn't work and might devastate the economy. Going to court to reorganize would be ``a very inhospitable environment for any of these guys,'' Ross, 70, said in an interview yesterday. ``It would be a total mess.'' His views run counter to those of investors such as hedge- fund manager William Ackman and executives including Jack Welch, the former chief executive officer of General Electric Co., who have said the automakers could solve some of their problems by restructuring in bankruptcy court. Others side with Ross. Ross, dubbed the ``King of Bankruptcy'' by Fortune magazine in 1998, said a restructuring bid by one of the three top U.S. automakers would topple its peers and drive weakened suppliers out of business because the credit crunch dried up financing. ``If we were in a different overall economic environment, one of them going down wouldn't necessarily kill'' the industry, he said. A weakened economy and frozen debt markets make an automaker bankruptcy impossible, with a Chapter 11 filing for reorganization resulting in liquidation instead, Ross said. Failures by automakers and related businesses would lead to a drain on government spending for unemployment benefits, health care and pension recoveries, said Ross, whose WL Ross & Co. is based in New York. GM has said bankruptcy isn't an option. Ross's holdings include auto-parts maker International Automotive Components Group, which he assembled by buying assets from Lear Corp. and bankrupt Collins & Aikman Corp. He said he isn't advocating a U.S. industry bailout to aid his interests. `Doesn't Add Up' GM, Ford and Chrysler have asked for $25 billion in bridge loans to support their operations while they weather the worst automotive market in 17 years. Such legislation is being crafted by Democratic Senator Carl Levin and Representative Barney Frank, respectively of Michigan and Massachusetts. The Bush administration opposes tapping the $700 billion financial-rescue package for automakers. ``It doesn't add up that they are letting GE and American Express to become banks to get aid, but they won't save the car industry,'' said Ross. Ross created International Steel Group Inc. from the assets of LTV Corp., Bethlehem Steel Corp. and Weirton Steel Corp. at a time when the U.S. steel industry had gone through 35 bankruptcies in five years. After taking it public, in 2004 he agreed to sell the company to billionaire Lakshmi Mittal for $4.5 billion. Ross said the steel industry consolidation occurred when the economy was healthier and banks were willing to lend money. ``It was a far different set of facts than we have now.'' To contact the reporter on this story: Mike Ramsey in Southfield, Michigan, at mramsey6@bloomberg.net Last Updated: November 14, 2008 00:01 EST

To: Knighty Tin who wrote (78604)	11/19/2008 6:46:45 PM
From: stockman_scott	Respond to of 89467

Tonight's Guest on CNN's Larry King Live: Michael Moore The man who confronted General Motors, in a movie that made history, joins Larry to answer the question everyone's asking today: Should American automakers be bailed out of financial trouble or should they go bust? The "Roger and Me" mastermind's not holding back! Tonight, 9 ET

To: Knighty Tin who wrote (78604)	11/23/2008 4:47:50 PM
From: stockman_scott	1 Recommendation Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 89467

This was written by a well known sports columnist in Detroit who is also the author of the best selling book Tuesdays with Morrie... freep.com If I had the floor at the auto rescue talks BY MITCH ALBOM DETROIT FREE PRESS COLUMNIST November 23, 2008 OK. It's a fantasy. But if I had five minutes in front of Congress last week, here's what I would've said: Good morning. First of all, before you ask, I flew commercial. Northwest Airlines. Had a bag of peanuts for breakfast. Of course, that's Northwest, which just merged with Delta, a merger you, our government, approved -- and one which, inevitably, will lead to big bonuses for their executives and higher costs for us. You seem to be OK with that kind of business. Which makes me wonder why you're so against our kind of business? The kind we do in Detroit. The kind that gets your fingernails dirty. The kind where people use hammers and drills, not keystrokes. The kind where you get paid for making something, not moving money around a board and skimming a percentage. You've already given hundreds of billions to banking and finance companies -- and hardly demanded anything. Yet you balk at the very idea of giving $25 billion to the Detroit Three. Heck, you shoveled that exact amount to Citigroup -- $25 billion -- just weeks ago, and that place is about to crumble anyhow. Does the word "hypocrisy" ring a bell? Protecting the home turf? Sen. Shelby. Yes. You. From Alabama. You've been awfully vocal. You called the Detroit Three's leaders "failures." You said loans to them would be "wasted money." You said they should go bankrupt and "let the market work." Why weren't you equally vocal when your state handed out hundreds of millions in tax breaks to Mercedes-Benz, Hyundai, Honda and others to open plants there? Why not "let the market work"? Or is it better for Alabama if the Detroit Three fold so that the foreign companies -- in your state -- can produce more? Way to think of the nation first, senator. And you, Sen. Kyl of Arizona. You told reporters: "There's no reason to throw money at a problem that's not going to get solved." That's funny, coming from such an avid supporter of the Iraq war. You've been gung ho on that for years. So how could you just sit there when, according to the New York Times, an Iraqi former chief investigator told Congress that $13 billion in U.S. reconstruction funds "had been lost to fraud, embezzlement, theft and waste" by the Iraqi government? That's 13 billion, senator. More than half of what the auto industry is asking for. Thirteen billion? Gone? Wasted? Where was your "throwing money at a problem that's not going to get solved" speech then? Watching over the bankers? And the rest of you lawmakers. The ones who insist the auto companies show you a plan before you help them. You've already handed over $150 billion of our tax money to AIG. How come you never demanded a plan from it? How come when AIG blew through its first $85 billion, you quickly gave it more? The car companies may be losing money, but they can explain it: They're paying workers too much and selling cars for too little. AIG lost hundreds of billions in credit default swaps -- which no one can explain and which make nothing, produce nothing, employ no one and are essentially bets on failure. And you don't demand a paragraph from it? Look. Nobody is saying the auto business is healthy. Its unions need to adjust more. Its models and dealerships need to shrink. Its top executives have to downsize their own importance. But this is a business that has been around for more than a century. And some of its problems are because of that, because people get used to certain wages, manufacturers get used to certain business models. It's easy to point to foreign carmakers with tax breaks, no union costs and a cleaner slate -- not to mention help from their home countries -- and say "be more like them." But if you let us die, you let our national spine collapse. America can't be a country of lawyers and financial analysts. We have to manufacture. We need that infrastructure. We need those jobs. We need that security. Have you forgotten who built equipment during the world wars? Besides, let's be honest. When it comes to blowing budgets, being grossly inefficient and wallowing in debt, who's better than Congress? So who are you to lecture anyone on how to run a business? Ask fair questions. Demand accountability. But knock it off with the holier than thou crap, OK? You got us into this mess with greed, a bad Fed policy and too little regulation. Don't kick our tires to make yourselves look better.