SI
SI
discoversearch

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor.  We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community.  If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.
Politics : President Barack Obama -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (45479)11/22/2008 3:37:47 AM
From: tejek  Respond to of 149317
 
To get $70 an hour at a big tech company as a stable full time contractor with no benefits is more of a management or analyst type position. Way above an assembly line worker

The article makes very clear....auto workers are not getting paid $70 per hour. Instead, they get $27 per hour plus health benefits that total no where near $70.



To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (45479)11/22/2008 7:51:41 AM
From: sylvester80  Read Replies (3) | Respond to of 149317
 
As it was very well explained, that $70 is a myth and it includes the benefits of 100s of thousands of retirees. It is NOT a "current workers" benefit. It includes everyone that has EVER worked at the big 3 in the last 100 years.

So... what do you want the companies to do with all these retirees?? Throw them under a bus??? Would current working Americans like for companies to do the same to them when they retire too??

And make no mistake. The foreign companies have similar retiree benefits as well. The problem is that they only been in business for such few years that the number of their retirees is a thousand or so not the 100s of thousands that the big 3 have.

BTW, I do not have a good answer to this problem as with our huge deficit and huge bailouts, it is a problem that is going to affect every working American going forward. You think the big 3 have a problem with their retiree benefits now?? Just wait when the vast baby boomers population retires and need their social security money from a bankrupt U.S. government and all those worthless IOUs instead of the social security money they put into the system.

And after this stock market implosion, and housing implosion, they have no money, no 401Ks, no house equity and no health insurance to sustain them during their retiree years.

Should we throw all those millions under a bus too???

Republicans for decades have been saying "deficits don't matter" and spend their way into bankruptcy (mainly in huge defense programs with nothing to show for other than enriching the fat cats and with tax cuts for the rich). Those freaking traitors should all be in jail now.... or worse... much worse...

Again, I have no easy answers. But I do know that if we as a country need to come together more than ever now and face facts, tighten our belts and figure out real solutions. It is time we secured America with a universal health care system for everyone and STOP enriching and transferring our wealth to our middle east enemies via our oil addiction.



To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (45479)11/22/2008 1:07:10 PM
From: tejek  Respond to of 149317
 
Cuts beyond UAW's jobs bank seen

Workers: Auto executives must sacrifice, too

BY KATIE MERX and TIM HIGGINS • FREE PRESS BUSINESS WRITERS • November 22, 2008

Concessions by the UAW on the jobs banks may help win support for federal loans to help Detroit's automakers survive the global credit crisis, but it would need to be part of a broad package of concessions from all levels of the companies, workers and analysts told the Free Press on Friday.

Dismantling the jobs bank is among many measures the automakers are actively discussing with the union as they hustle to prepare a plan to convince Congress to approve $25 billion in federal loans for the automakers, the Free Press reported exclusively Friday.

"It's not a bad idea that it's at least dawned on them that they have an image and public relations problem," said Harry Katz, dean of Cornell University's School of Industrial and Labor Relations. "But they're going to have to go much, much further and deeper."

Asked Friday if further UAW concessions would help pass a federal aid package for Detroit, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., said: "I think everybody has to participate in ensuring the viability of the auto industry."

General Motors Corp., Ford Motor Co. and Chrysler LLC all have reported spending operating funds faster than they collect them for the last several months as financial turmoil has pushed U.S. auto sales to their lowest level in 25 years. GM and Chrysler have said their cash reserves could fall below the level necessary for operations by the end of the year.

Congress asked the automakers to deliver plans by Dec. 2 that detail how much they need and how they would spend federal loan money. Several members of Congress said any plan should include sacrifice from all levels of the organizations.

The jobs bank, a much-maligned program under which laid-off autoworkers are paid long after their jobs are cut, is one of the sacrifices the UAW may make.

In one proposal that has been discussed, workers would get near-full pay for 18 months during a layoff period, but there would be no jobs bank program after that.

Perception is everything
A UAW spokesman declined to comment Friday.

UAW President Ron Gettelfinger, who joined the auto executives in testifying before Congress, bristled this week at the notion that the union hasn't given concessions on the program before.

Gettelfinger said there is a lack of appreciation for how the program has been scaled back to almost being gone.

Until the union's 2007 contract, workers could remain in the jobs banks for years. But under the new contract, the union conceded to tighter conditions, under which workers' jobs are protected by the jobs bank for just two years, and less if employees turn down transfers.

"Going back to the '07 negotiations," Gettelfinger said, "we took that language and stripped it down to where it's the mere shadow of what it used to be."

Asked Thursday if the UAW would be willing to give up such a provision as part of conditions for government aid, Gettelfinger said, "It's premature for me to answer a speculative question. ... Let's wait and see what they come down with."

The jobs bank may now be a minor program, but it stands tall as a symbol of excess and inefficiency to those outside Detroit, experts say. And for that reason, as much as any other, it may have to go, experts say.

"It seems like folks are getting paid for waiting. That doesn't seem to be following the American way of rugged individualism," said James Cashman, a management professor from the University of Alabama who spent several years working as a consultant for GM.

Jobs banks come from an era when automakers' manufacturing processes were being modernized to include technological improvements and the companies needed to win labor support for such innovations that seemingly would mean a loss of jobs.

"The jobs bank notion was created long ago with the idea of being a temporary location for people who were being displaced by upgrades in technology," Cashman said. "That whole premise seemed to have died long ago, and jobs banks have been, from the perspective of folks down here, kind of abused ever since."

Eye for an eye

UAW members say they have foregone increases in pay and benefits over the years in exchange for the job security provided by the jobs bank and would expect to see significant concessions in executive pay and from other constituencies if they are to give up that protection.

"People just think we're a bunch of overpaid autoworkers," said Mike Mitchell, 35, an assembly worker at GM's Fairfax Assembly in Kansas City, Kan. "If we're laid off for 12 months because we worked overtime for half a year and then had too many vehicles in inventory, who screwed up?"

If the automakers are going to be allowed to eliminate the long-held security of the jobs bank, he said, they better act more responsibly in their production plans and work steadily to produce vehicles.

They also better include significant executive sacrifice, he said.

"When they present the plan to Congress on Dec. 2," he said, "each party to this is going to have to make major concessions, or there's going to be a problem."


Contact KATIE MERX at 313-222-8762 or kmerx@freepress.com. Staff writers Justin Hyde and Brent Snavely contributed to this report.

freep.com