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Politics : Politics of Energy -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Bearcatbob who wrote (3204)	11/29/2008 7:07:53 AM
From: RetiredNow	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 86352

Bob, you make a great show of arguing rationally and then you don't address the massive subsidies our government makes to keep oil priced as low as possible. In economics, we price in externalities so that the true costs are known and accounted for in the market place. If we were to place a true price on oil, then we'd price in the cost of securing our shipping lanes to transport oil, the wars and other security apparatus we pay for that is directly tied to ensuring we have a ready supply of oil, the environmental impacts that lead to health issues like asthma and lung disease in our most polluted cities, the below market leases on government land given to the oil companies, and the direct tax subsidies we give to the industry. Take all of that into account and I'd bet alternatives would start to look very competitive. However, there is a stubborn refusal of many folks in this country to look at these things holistically? Why is that? I don't think most people are malicious and don't blame them, rather I believe most are just uninformed or undereducated in economics. I do blame the very effective PR and lobbying machine of the oil companies, though.

To: Bearcatbob who wrote (3204)	11/29/2008 11:42:11 AM
From: Eric	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 86352

Just as Mindmeld mentioned the true costs of carbon based fuels is much, much higher and more and more people are slowly beginning to see how they have been duped by things beginning way back with the 1872 mining law as an example. We gave license to a few folks to rape the land and cause numerous problems that all of us are only now just beginning to pay for. A friend of mine at the U of W department of Atmospherics pointed out to me just how bad things have gotten with coal fired generation in the world. The U has air monitoring stations on the Washington coastline that have been there for over 40 years. Up until about 15 years ago they would go out and change the air monitoring filters approximately every two weeks and they would come out absolutely white. Now they come out almost black! The reason is the explosive growth of coal fired power plants in China. It's even begun to affect the glaciers on Mt. Rainier here, not to mention the lakes in the Olympic and Cascade mountains are starting to acidify. That IS a fact. We could go on and about the effects that are directly related to our burning carbon based fuels at ever higher rates on this planet.