Silicon Investor (SI) -- The First Internet Community

STOCKTALK

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor. We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community. If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.

Politics : A US National Health Care System? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: John Koligman who wrote (6070)	2/12/2009 11:35:15 AM
From: TimF	Respond to of 42652

Last anyone looked, the number 47 million uninsured was being thrown around. Not a very good number, for reasons that where disused here. But OTOH even a much smaller number would not automatically invalidate your argument.

To: John Koligman who wrote (6070)	2/12/2009 1:45:19 PM
From: Peter Dierks	1 Recommendation Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 42652

It's a matter of life and death for many people, in addition to bankruptcy when serious illness occurs. So, even IF it is somewhat inefficient, DO IT... If it is a matter of life and death to some people then those people have an incentive to address their problem. Just because I have a problems does not mean you need to solve it. The inverse applies. The Republicans don't seem to have a problem demonizing union workers for wanting a decent wage and good health benefits, Somehow getting paid to get drunk at a bar instead of doing a union job ever Friday does not seem like "wanting a decent wage ". Pitty the poor people who work for Toyota and other foreign car makers who seem to be able to struggle by on half what the union thugs who refuse to produce at a reasonable rate demand. Nobody has to demonize unions, all they have to do is publicise their abuses and the facts do a great job of demonizing them. We also don't seem to have a problem fighting multiple trillion dollar wars that have no end in sight. Please enlighten us as to the identity of even one conflict that cost America as much as the Pelosi / Obama Porkulus being inflicted on our grandchildren. Since there are none, your rant seems a bit off key. Besides, our vaunted 'private' health insurance system has already resulted in per capita costs WAY HIGHER than countries that have universal care. That has been addressed long ago with the free rider problem. If you decline to process the information you can at least understand me not wanting to keep teaching the same lesson. Last anyone looked, the number 47 million uninsured was being thrown around. Which has been debunked every time it was thrown around. So why do you keep bringing up something you know is misrepresentative of the facts? Guess what, 3.6 million jobs lost over the past year, millions more this year, so that number will be interesting to see in 2010 Yeah the 500 million jobs that Pelosi says we will lose could be very troubling for the 100 million or so workers in America. The Obama recession looks to be very harmful to America. As far as efficiency is concerned, perhaps medicare can be used as a base model, I've read some good things about how that system works... Yeah, it is the poster child for why government should not be allowed any involvement with heathcare payment systems. The bottom line is if government is charitably assumed to be 75% as efficient as motivated capitalists then our health care cost should increase by roughly 2/3 in the short run. If you bring in the 35 million or so who are uninsured. This increases the base fo patients from roughly 200 million to 235 million. This yields a 17.5% increase in costs. Divide the 235 by .75 and the divide the result by 200. This is a 56.66% increase in healthcare costs. The only way to reduce it is by reducing per incident payments or rationing. Would you prefer to drive medical providers from the business or be denied coverage for your condition?

To: John Koligman who wrote (6070)	2/12/2009 2:58:02 PM
From: TimF	Respond to of 42652

The Republicans don't seem to have a problem demonizing union workers for wanting a decent wage and good health benefits Republicans (or at least the smaller group "conservatives", and certainly "libertarian minded conservatives") don't generally demonize union workers for wanting a decent wage and good health benefits. To the extent that they demonize them at all (and its usually more "oppose" or "disagree with", rather than "demonize") it for trying its for asking for and getting special government benefits that help them control the supply of labor in certain situations, tending to push prices costs up, and worse decrease flexibility of operations, to an extent that makes some businesses uncompetitive, and in sectors where there is less competition, reduces the real after tax income of non-union workers by increasing prices charged for goods and services in the private sector, and increasing the cost of government.