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Politics : The Environmentalist Thread -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Bread Upon The Water who wrote (25722)	11/11/2009 2:31:57 PM
From: Maurice Winn	3 Recommendations Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 36917

Vint, I'm going to get a bit snobby here. Much of so-called "science" and many so-called "scientists" are merely glorified stamp collectors or numismatists. Collecting, enumerating, documenting and describing the natural world is definitely a good thing, but as with any trade, there are levels of competency and the intellectual horsepower required to perform some tasks is a lot lower than others. Scientists understanding and taming fusion are not the same as "scientists' collecting coelacanths. Jim Jones and David Koresh were "priests" but they weren't in the same league as the Pope. Environmental "science" seems to attract the David Koresh and Jim Jones type of theologian. I hasten to add that I'm not racist against environmental scientists. Heck, some of my best friends are environmental scientists. Also, I firmly believe environmentalists [not just environmental scientists] should have full human rights. How broad-minded is that?! I noticed that and was going to climb all over it: <The scientists speculate that toxic chemicals are leaching into fish tissue from the plastic they eat. The researchers say that when a predator — a larger fish or a person — eats the fish that eats the plastic, that predator may be transferring toxins to its own tissues, and in greater concentrations since toxins from multiple food sources can accumulate in the body. > Already, you have converted an idle speculation halfway into an internet fact - "Plasticized poisons from plastic gyres are accumulating up the ocean food chain faster than mercury". Note their use of the words "speculate" and "may". That means they have no data. Data which could be obtained by the simple expedient of catching a couple of big fish and a few small ones that they eat then testing them to see what plastic compounds have accumulated. Note too the ridiculous photo presented as evidence of a terrible gyre - a net and a few ropes which look as though they've just gone overboard or even been put there for the purpose of taking the photo. There was nothing scientific about any of it. I speculate that the little fish will have metabolic processes quite capable of excreting plastic muck along with other extraneous materials which don't belong in their physiology. Mqurice

To: Bread Upon The Water who wrote (25722)	11/28/2009 2:11:19 PM
From: Maurice Winn	1 Recommendation Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 36917

Vint, I'm reposting this because only a week later the exposure of the emails showed what I was explaining. They are not scientists, they are theological stamp collectors with some trivial knowledge of statistics. <Vint, I'm going to get a bit snobby here. Much of so-called "science" and many so-called "scientists" are merely glorified STAMP COLLECTORS or numismatists. Collecting, enumerating, documenting and describing the natural world is definitely a good thing, but as with any trade, there are levels of competency and the intellectual horsepower required to perform some tasks is a lot lower than others. SCIENTISTS understanding and taming fusion are not the same as "scientists' collecting coelacanths. Jim Jones and David Koresh were "priests" but they weren't in the same league as the Pope. Environmental "science" seems to attract the David Koresh and Jim Jones type of theologian. I hasten to add that I'm not racist against environmental SCIENTISTS. Heck, some of my best friends are environmental SCIENTISTS. Also, I firmly believe environmentalists [not just environmental scientists] should have full human rights. How broad-minded is that?! I noticed that and was going to climb all over it: <The SCIENTISTS speculate that toxic chemicals are leaching into fish tissue from the plastic they eat. The researchers say that when a predator — a larger fish or a person — eats the fish that eats the plastic, that predator may be transferring toxins to its own tissues, and in greater concentrations since toxins from multiple food sources can accumulate in the body. > Already, you have converted an idle speculation halfway into an internet fact - "Plasticized poisons from plastic gyres are accumulating up the ocean food chain faster than mercury". Note their use of the words "speculate" and "may". That means they have no data. Data which could be obtained by the simple expedient of catching a couple of big fish and a few small ones that they eat then testing them to see what plastic compounds have accumulated. Note too the ridiculous photo presented as evidence of a terrible gyre - a net and a few ropes which look as though they've just gone overboard or even been put there for the purpose of taking the photo. There was nothing scientific about any of it. I speculate that the little fish will have metabolic processes quite capable of excreting plastic muck along with other extraneous materials which don't belong in their physiology.> The gyres of plastic are like the tornadoes of global warming = numismatist so-called scientists pushing a self-dealing barrow like any medieval priesthood. The emails show their attitudes, values, intentions, scientific illiteracy and criminal conspiracy to defraud. But real scientists didn't need the emails to see that that's what was going on. Don't forget those emails are just a few which were found and are polite discussions among "scientific" colleagues about their real feelings and thoughts. Mqurice