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Politics : Liberalism: Do You Agree We've Had Enough of It? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: lorne who wrote (76615)	12/20/2009 12:00:55 PM
From: lorne	2 Recommendations Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 224718

Obama's Facebook statue hate group Sunday December 20, 2009 www2.skynews.com.au Most Indonesians love Barack Obama. Why then have 26,000 Indonesians united to bring him down? They've all become members of a new Facebook group formed for a single purpose: to topple the US president. Not the flesh and blood guy that lives in the White House, mind you. Rather, they want to topple a small bronze statue of Obama as a young boy, recently erected in a Jakarta park. The $A10,000 statue shows the 10-year-old Obama, wearing shorts and a T-shirt, smiling at a butterfly that has landed on his hand. The statue stands in Menteng Park, a few blocks from the neighbourhood where Obama lived for four years with his mother and Indonesian stepfather. According to Central Jakarta Mayor Sylviana Murni, the statue will give Indonesian children 'the spirit to reach their dreams'. 'There is a message through the young Obama statue that any child and anyone from any background can reach their dreams if they fight for it persistently,' Murni gushed. But those who've joined the 'Take down the Barack Obama statue from Menteng Park' Facebook group believe the bronze boy sends a different message. 'For me, the establishment of the statue shows that this country no longer has national pride,' Heru Nugroho, the group's creator, has told local media. 'Obama spent several years of his childhood here, but what did he do for Indonesia?' Members want the city to tear down the statue. Some say that if the city doesn't, they will. 'Is it our habit to honour foreign people more than our own?' one member asks. 'Where is our dignity as a country?' 'Doesn't Indonesia have its own heroes?' Some members list more appropriate local candidates for statuehood: badminton legend Rudy Hartono; composer and musician Ismail Marzuki; poet and playwright WS Rendra. Some have even suggested Obama be torn down to make way for a statue of Inul Daratista, the notorious local 'dangdut' performer famed for her sexually suggestive 'drilling' dance move. Although that might cause controversy of its own.

To: lorne who wrote (76615)	12/20/2009 1:33:09 PM
From: FJB	1 Recommendation Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 224718

It is hard for me to have sympathy for these people that keep sending this relic, KKK Wizard back to Congress. This guy should not have served a single term, let alone spent his whole life in Congress. Democrats - the party of slavery and racism...

To: lorne who wrote (76615)	12/20/2009 1:41:46 PM
From: MJ	1 Recommendation Respond to of 224718

Lorne Here is my first take on this. Senator Byrd may have said or read the words; however, my sense of this indicates that this was only partially Byrd speaking. There is much more to this than meets the eye-----mountain top mining came into being because environmentalist objected to miners going underground to mine coal----and the black lung disease that coal miners often end up with in working with coal. Now they are saying they were wrong-----so what's the next step------what is the next move to a solution to mine coal, minerals and shale, limestone that West Virginia is so rich in. My conjecture is that this is not Byrd's own opinion that much of this is coming from those who would like to abolish all coal mining totally while drawing up on drilling into the coal fields for Natural Gas and for stripping the shale from the mountains. E.g. Natural gas pipelines have been proposed to cross the mountains along the border of West Virginia and Virginia to feed the urbanization of the corridor along the Shenandoah Valley and into Northern Virginia-----not without opposition. For people in Virginia this becomes an environmental issue as these natural gas lines (surface pipes) will run along the tops of mountains from West Virginia and into major residential areas. Early in Obama's campaign he came out for coal gasification and liquification of coal such as is done in Africa. (Said to be a clean way of mining coal and its by products----who knows???) Suddenly he dropped it this was very early in his campaign---------and went to his two word campaign. HERE IS THE CLUE TO MY CONJECTURE: "Over the past six months, however, Byrd has dropped hints that some environmental activists have interpreted as signs he was taking a new approach to coal. In June, he announced that staffers would investigate the effects of mountaintop removal to surrounding areas. And even as he expressed skepticism of the Democratic push for climate change legislation this year, Byrd declared in late October that “we will show that clean coal can be a ‘green’ energy.” “Our eldest statesman seems to be our only leader that is thinking about the future and how it is time to turn to a low-carbon economy,” said Vivian Stockman of the Ohio Valley Environmental Coalition, an organization that is rallying against mountaintop removal. “It was a big boost.” Jesse Jacobs, a Byrd spokesman, declined to comment on Byrd’s statement, saying it “speaks for itself.” FURTHER COMMENT: See the paragraph I quoted from the message---------Senator Byrd's Staffers did the research and reported back to Byrd---did the staffers influence Senator Byrd's speech and maybe even write it for him? CHECK INTO WHERE THE COAL GOES THAT IS MINED IN W. Va.------this may give a clue to the connection with the titular Obama administration. mj

To: lorne who wrote (76615)	12/20/2009 6:49:21 PM
From: MJ	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 224718

Loren Are the comments by Byrd that were given herein-----as you noted? Or are these comments preliminary to Byrd's comments you mentioned? This page has the "complete comments of Byrd"-----I know nothing about this organization; what I do know is that there is concern over the mountain top mining/stripping due to the impact on towns and vallies that adjoin these mountains. Sure we will hear more about West Virginia, Kentucky and the states adjoining West Virginia in this debate over Byrd's remarks. Of course the title here assumes a future without any specific future being given. Could it be that the future must embrace coal as an essential natural resource to be mined and used? ----mj ilovemountains.org is Senator Byrd’s complete statement: "COAL MUST EMBRACE THE FUTURE Senator Robert C. Byrd (D-W.Va.) For more than 100 years, coal has been the backbone of the Appalachian economy. Even today, the economies of more than 20 states depend to some degree on the mining of coal. About half of all the electricity generated in America and about one quarter of all the energy consumed globally is generated by coal. Change is no stranger to the coal industry. Think of the huge changes which came with the onset of the Machine Age in the late 1800’s. Mechanization has increased coal production and revenues, but also has eliminated jobs, hurting the economies of coal communities. In 1979, there were 62,500 coal miners in the Mountain State. Today there are about 22,000. In recent years, West Virginia has seen record high coal production and record low coal employment. And change is undeniably upon the coal industry again. The increased use of mountaintop removal mining means that fewer miners are needed to meet company production goals. Meanwhile the Central Appalachian coal seams that remain to be mined are becoming thinner and more costly to mine. Mountaintop removal mining, a declining national demand for energy, rising mining costs and erratic spot market prices all add up to fewer jobs in the coal fields. These are real problems. They affect real people. And West Virginia’s elected officials are rightly concerned about jobs and the economic impact on local communities. I share those concerns. But the time has come to have an open and honest dialogue about coal’s future in West Virginia. Let’s speak the truth. The most important factor in maintaining coal-related jobs is demand for coal. Scapegoating and stoking fear among workers over the permitting process is counter-productive. Coal companies want a large stockpile of permits in their back pockets because that implies stability to potential investors. But when coal industry representatives stir up public anger toward federal regulatory agencies, it can damage the state’s ability to work with those agencies to West Virginia’s benefit. This, in turn, may create the perception of ineffectiveness within the industry, which can drive potential investors away. Let’s speak a little more truth here. No deliberate effort to do away with the coal industry could ever succeed in Washington because there is no available alternative energy supply that could immediately supplant the use of coal for base load power generation in America. That is a stubborn fact that vexes some in the environmental community, but it is reality. It is also a reality that the practice of mountaintop removal mining has a diminishing constituency in Washington. It is not a widespread method of mining, with its use confined to only three states. Most members of Congress, like most Americans, oppose the practice, and we may not yet fully understand the effects of mountaintop removal mining on the health of our citizens. West Virginians may demonstrate anger toward the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) over mountaintop removal mining, but we risk the very probable consequence of shouting ourselves out of any productive dialogue with EPA and our adversaries in the Congress. Some have even suggested that coal state representatives in Washington should block any advancement of national health care reform legislation until the coal industry’s demands are met by the EPA. I believe that the notion of holding the health care of over 300 million Americans hostage in exchange for a handful of coal permits is beyond foolish; it is morally indefensible. It is a non-starter, and puts the entire state of West Virginia and the coal industry in a terrible light. To be part of any solution, one must first acknowledge a problem. To deny the mounting science of climate change is to stick our heads in the sand and say “deal me out.” West Virginia would be much smarter to stay at the table. The 20 coal-producing states together hold some powerful political cards. We can have a part in shaping energy policy, but we must be honest brokers if we have any prayer of influencing coal policy on looming issues important to the future of coal like hazardous air pollutants, climate change, and federal dollars for investments in clean coal technology. Most people understand that America cannot meet its current energy needs without coal, but there is strong bi-partisan opposition in Congress to the mountaintop removal method of mining it. We have our work cut out for us in finding a prudent and profitable middle ground – but we will not reach it by using fear mongering, grandstanding and outrage as a strategy. As your United States Senator, I must represent the opinions and the best interests of the entire Mountain State, not just those of coal operators and southern coalfield residents who may be strident supporters of mountaintop removal mining. I have spent the past six months working with a group of coal state Democrats in the Senate, led by West Virginia native Senator Tom Carper (D-Del.), drafting provisions to assist the coal industry in more easily transitioning to a lower-carbon economy. These include increasing funding for clean coal projects and easing emission standards and timelines, setting aside billions of dollars for coal plants that install new technology and continue using coal. These are among the achievable ways coal can continue its major role in our national energy portfolio. It is the best way to step up to the challenge and help lead change. The truth is that some form of climate legislation will likely become public policy because most American voters want a healthier environment. Major coal-fired power plants and coal operators operating in West Virginia have wisely already embraced this reality, and are making significant investments to prepare. The future of coal and indeed of our total energy picture lies in change and innovation. In fact, the future of American industrial power and our economic ability to compete globally depends on our ability to advance energy technology. The greatest threats to the future of coal do not come from possible constraints on mountaintop removal mining or other environmental regulations, but rather from rigid mindsets, depleting coal reserves, and the declining demand for coal as more power plants begin shifting to biomass and natural gas as a way to reduce emissions. Fortunately, West Virginia has a running head-start as an innovator. Low-carbon and renewable energy projects are already under development in West Virginia, including: America’s first integrated carbon capture and sequestration project on a conventional coal-fired power plant in Mason County; the largest wind power facility in the eastern United States; a bio-fuel refinery in Nitro; three large wood pellet plants in Fayette, Randolph, and Gilmer Counties; and major dams capable of generating substantial electricity. Change has been a constant throughout the history of our coal industry. West Virginians can choose to anticipate change and adapt to it, or resist and be overrun by it. One thing is clear. The time has arrived for the people of the Mountain State to think long and hard about which course they want to choose. This entry was posted on Friday, December 4th, 2009 at 2:07 am and is filed under News. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can skip to the end and leave a response. 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