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Pastimes : The New Qualcomm - write what you like thread. -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Art Bechhoefer who wrote (9226)1/20/2010 12:28:10 PM
From: Maurice Winn3 Recommendations  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 12235
 
Art, don't put much faith in the "generally accepted" scientific establishment. That's the same generally accepted flat earth society which generally accepted flat earth, bleeding with leeches to cure things [maybe even anaemia and yes I know leeches are good to keep circulation going in wounded extremities], eating of eggs caused heart disease, thalidomide was a good idea for pregnant women, Newtonian mechanics, vitamins as unnecessary.

On a daily basis, studies are presented with correlation confused with causation.

BP Oil paid me good money to know about fuel quality, emissions and how to fix things up while making money. That was a couple of decades ago but things don't change too much to keep up near enough with the principles involved.

My original conclusions on CO2 are still true. My original solution if it is a problem, which it still isn't, is now adopted by Hansen the chief Climate Alarmist who opposes Cap and Trade as a solution.

Don't believe everything you read from the panic merchants. Surely you have read about Climategate and how "The Science" has been developed.

You made the same mistake of confusing correlation with causation <If one wanted to reduce CO2 emissions (which HAVE caused measurable temperature changes, especially in the last 50 years) >

There was a very slight temperature increase but lately a decrease which was contrary to the computer-based climate models invented by the so-called "experts".

In science, when data conflicts with theories, it's the theory which is bung, not the data. Saying, "Oh, that's just a glitch, ignore it and it'll go away" isn't good enough. The theory has to include the facts. When the models can't even match the data for 10 years, let alone 100 or 1000, they are tantamount to useless.

If you look at solar activity over those 50 years of increase, you'll see sunspot activity at highs. There are hundreds of years of records. As you might know, if you turn a heater up, sitting in front of it gets hotter. If you turn it down, it gets colder and children start arguing over the available heat and pushing each other out of the way.

The temperature increase did apparently exist [though I distrust their recording techniques so wouldn't bet too strongly that they are correct] but it was not even 1 degree Celsius. Half a century of vast CO2 output and all we can come up with is half a degree while the sun's output was also blazing.

Now, as the sun fizzles, temperatures have dropped and reglaciation appears imminent. Snow and low temperatures have been major problems around the northern hemisphere. Contrary to the most absurd claims, snow, ice and freezing temperatures are NOT global warming. Even Warmists will eventually have to start using words like "cold" when they are buried in metres of snow and their ears snap off from the freezing.

Pushing the tops off mountains to dig coal is okay by me. Mountains and valleys get there by nature eroding the mountains. Helping nature along is fine. People living nearby would expect to have the dust kept down and the creeks kept clean and that's not too hard with earth filtration of run-off.

Level ground is convenient for building airports, towns, growing crops and doing other things. Mountains fall down and can be quite annoying to build on. The valleys could be used as rubbish dumps and the mountain tops as backfill to cover the rubbish.

Actually, better use of rubbish is as a resource for materials. If criminals and unemployed people were given the job of sorting it out, nearly all of it would be good for something.

Banana skins for compost
Glass of various colours for all sorts of things
Paper for recycling or burning as fuel or compost
Metals for resmelting into ingots for industry
Plastics for recycling, structural fill materials, or fuel

Where there's muck there's brass.

Regarding asthma, NZ is asthma central and I lived with it for 3 decades, nearly dying from it. Now I have it figured out and get no asthma. Grandson, daughter, uncle, nieces, nephews - I'm surrounded by it. Dietary management and air quality are the two issues to control.

Controlling those externalities is the key to asthma [we can't change our DNA and history] <As usual, the problem with doing anything constructive on these issues is created by a lack of appreciation of what economists like to call "externalities." >

I have been an environmentalist since early childhood and have suffered the depredations of bad environmental management. It's quite frustrating how casually destructive authorities have been, and how they have allowed individuals to pollute and destroy the commons. But that doesn't mean any silly theory somebody claiming to be an environmentalist wants me to kneel before and hand them over my money is right.

As with religions and superstitions, yes, there are interesting questions about life, the universe and everything, but that doesn't mean any screwball megalomaniac after my money and daughters and wanting to boss me around has "the one true word".

Al Gore should get a real job doing something useful. Lying to children is not a good thing.

Property rights are the best way to identify value. <
Specific taxation to prevent undesirable after effects is, I think, a far more practical way to deal with the problem than tradable citizenships.
> In the USSR and China, individuals mean nothing. Check out their environmental destruction.

Perhaps you misunderstand what the words "tradable citizenship" mean.

Undesirable after effects? Which after effects and undesirable to who? Al Gore obviously just loves taxation and he plans to collect a LOT more taxes to fuel his jet-set lifestyle.

When people see the value of their property being destroyed we get some serious responses. When it's public assets being damaged, individuals are not so concerned. Somebody throwing a can over a fence into private property will get a different response than somebody dropping a can in a public space.

Mqurice