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To: koan who wrote (263111)	7/22/2010 8:11:11 PM
From: Reilly Diefenbach	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 306849

Tejek is a good guy. He cares about people. He worries about things like injustice and the poor and downtrodden. Not everyone does. It's incorrect to assume that those of us who don't happen to subscribe to your liberal, or progressive (or I'd call social democrat) world view DON'T care about other people. As for myself, I find it far better to teach a person to fish than to hand that person a fish. It creates a much healthier situation overall for everyone when people are able to take responsibility for themselves and we don't have people on a permanent dole. And the danger to this country is coming from the large corporations, and the rich, not government. We are a democracy and we can vote out governments any time we want, but we have no control over corporations and they are increasingly buying our congressional representatives through huge campaign contributions and lobbbyists. I have a couple of points to make here: 1) I think that the danger question is sort of a chicken-or-egg thing. If the rich or large corporations are able to exert so much force on government (and I'm not arguing that they don't), I blame government through our elected officials for the situation. Elected officials receive their votes from and are morally bound by their oath of office to represent the views and needs of their electorate. I agree that the way that we treat corporations is screwed up, but this needs to be addressed legislatively, not by a court essentially writing legislation from the bench. 2) Both you and tejek seem bound and determined to ignore the fact that we are a DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC, not a democracy. We don't have elections "any time" but only as prescribed by the law. And the instructions for governing are based on the constitution and our laws, not whims. Your lack of respect for these facts parallels the lack of respect for the law we so often see from activist judges who tend to disregard the law and the constitution when it interferes with their agenda and/or world view.

To: koan who wrote (263111)	7/22/2010 8:38:17 PM
From: Skeeter Bug	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 306849

>>Tejek is a good guy. He cares about people. He worries about things like injustice and the poor and downtrodden. Not everyone does.<< how does supporting a president that hands trillions over to cover bad bets of banks to be paid off, with full compounding interest to the very same banking institutions that were bailed out express "caring for the little guy?" >>And the danger to this country is coming from the large corporations, and the rich, not government.<< uh, the corporations are full on running and controlling the government. the private corporation WRITE THE FRAKKING LEGISLATION and the LEGISLATORS DON'T EVEN READ IT BEFORE VOTING! hell-freaking-lo?!?!? >>We are a democracy<< try constitutional republic. >>and we can vote out governments any time we want,<< we can vote in and out the kabuki theater the corporation allow us to see. where was the no war vote? there wasn't one. where was the no banker bailout vote? there wasn't one, even though obama lied about that while running posing as someone he wasn't. what about the non nafta vote? doesn't exist. what about the "defend the border" vote? nothing there. so, no, we can't vote for the above things b/c the corporate controllers use their money and their control over the media and candidates to make sure their basic agenda is met REGARDLESS OF WHICH PARTY WINS THE ELECTION! >>but we have no control over corporations and they are increasingly buying our congressional representatives through huge campaign contributions and lobbbyists.<< they already own the place. they have for a loooooong time. they haven't spent billions on congress for nothing. >>Between 2002 and 2006, 2/3rds of all the increased wealth in the nation went to the top 1% of the richest people in the country because they can hire lobbyists to write tax codes favorable to themselves and the congressional people let them do that because of the campaign contributions.<< and bush and obama had an absolutely FABULOUS transition when it came to opening the treasury wide to give the criminal bankers (they committed MASSIVE FRAUD!) basically unlimited cash. how is that helping the poor again? how is it that the poor are helped by protecting those criminals who sold known toxic waste assets as AAA to their pensions investment manager? be specific. >>The poor cannot do that. And over the last 30 years the divide between the rich and poor has widen considerably. Much worse than most western democracies. Shamful.<< and it has continued to accelerate under obama. nearly $3 trillion debt on the books have been offloaded from the richest people on Earth onto the poor and middle class of this nation. on the books. off the books, we are staring at another $1 to $2 trillion from fannie and freddie - and that's conservative if our economy implodes as i expect it to. we have another $2.4 trillion of illegal (not government backed) toxic trash sitting on the fed's balance sheet that is simply waiting for a ribbon to present it to the public - you know, the poor and middle class. the banks are already clamoring for another $2.6 trillion on top of that. on to the coup de gras... how does supporting a debt backed monetary system help the poor who can't afford to pay interest on money just because it exists and paid to people who did nothing to generate that money? how do the poor benefit from a man who is a credit pusher... "credit is the life blood of the economy" NOT industry (that provides jobs so people don't have to be freaking poor!). "credit is the basis of capital" not savings - b/c the banks have sucked everyone dry via their debt backed monetary crime. it is good to want to help the poor and needy - that's one reason why i fight these b*stards in power who spend their days screwing society over for a buck and good press. but get educated first or you will do more damage than good. ps - the trillions given to bankers would have ended poverty in america 11 years ago, but they didn't get it. they don't care about the poor, they care about the bankers - and made them whole so they could dole out $140 billion in bonuses to themselves for looting the poor and needy dry!