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Politics : Stockman Scott's Political Debate Porch -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: koan who wrote (83740)	10/3/2010 12:22:31 PM
From: longnshort	Respond to of 89467

you libs are slobs HATE RALLY: PROTESTERS SHAME AMERICA WITH TRASH LEFT BEHIND A detailed view of the debris left behind on the Washington Mall by leftist protesters at the Union-supported, NAACP-sponsored "One Nation" rally. We call on the NAACP to renounce and condemn the litterers within their ranks. breitbart.tv

To: koan who wrote (83740)	10/3/2010 12:52:05 PM
From: tejek	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 89467

We have to rip open this two-party duopoly and have it challenged by a serious third party that will talk about education reform, without worrying about offending unions; financial reform, without worrying about losing donations from Wall Street; corporate tax reductions to stimulate jobs, without worrying about offending the far left; energy and climate reform, without worrying about offending the far right and coal-state Democrats; and proper health care reform, without worrying about offending insurers and drug companies. I disagree. I don't think the problem is with the two parties. I think the problem is with Americans period. No one forced people to vote for Bush in 2000 and there was considerable evidence before he was elected that he and Cheney were a problem. In fact, there was enough evidence that an apolitical guy like me was alerted. For the first time in my life, I stayed up late watching the returns and got very upset when FLA flip flopped. By 2004, there was more than enough evidence that Bush/Cheney were a mess but again, Americans gladly voted for them. Why? Because they gave them a free ride in the form of tax cuts. In the last two years, the Dems have done a lot for people in this country. What is the reaction? The teapers. The white people are not happy. Why? They don't want to share with the non whites in this country. Americans don't want to do what's best for the country. They want to do what's best for their own particular self interests...for their race. Therein lies the problem and the corruption of the American dream. We've never accepted that we are hodge podge of religions and races......at least the white people haven't. And now that whites in this country are faced with the prospect of becoming a minority, they don't like it. And why are they faced with that prospect? Because they are not having enough children. And why aren't they having more children? Because they don't want the economic depravation that more children would cause. They are their own worse enemy but they refuse to see that. This whole thing has become a big joke. The parties, the systems, organizations etc are not the problem.......they still could work.......the probem is the people who make them up. We could have 14 parties and it wouldn't make a difference. People aren't willing to compromise. You, koan, aren't willing to accept not getting everything on your wishlist. That's the same with every damn American. Everyone wants exactly everything on their wishlist and nothing less.......and they sure as hell don't want to share. America is in decline because of its unwillingness to truly accept its raison d'etre for the past 250 years. "Give us your poor, your tired, your huddled masses longing to be free".....we never really bought it. It was just sentimental claptrap for the masses. And when those poor and huddled got here they were railroaded into ghettos and became cheap labor for our factories. Americans need to stop looking for pie in the sky solutions.......when the solutions are much closer to the ground and much more basic. And forget decline.......we are as close to civil war as we have been since 1865. If Americans don't start growing up and fast, and taking responsibility for the mess they have created, that civil war will happen. Mark my words!

To: koan who wrote (83740)	10/3/2010 12:55:14 PM
From: tejek	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 89467

FRIEDMAN'S THIRD-PARTY MESS.... Thomas Friedman joins a long list of centrist media figures to call for a third party to offer a sensible alternative to Democrats and Republicans. To put it charitably, the column is wildly unpersuasive. The general pitch is common, but lazy -- the parties are beholden to special interests, and refuse to tell Americans what we need to hear. To turn the country around, honest independents will swoop in and save us from ourselves and shake up the "stagnating two-party duopoly that has been presiding over our nation's steady incremental decline." I didn't care for this column the first hundred times it's been published over the years, and it's not improving with age. Indeed, the more one thinks about the details of Friedman's case, the weaker it appears. He argues, for example, that President Obama has delivered on some real accomplishments in less than two years -- health care reform, Wall Street reform, stabilizing the economy, launching education reform, successes on counter-terrorism -- but the system has prevented broader and better gains. Obama probably did the best he could do, and that's the point. The best our current two parties can produce today -- in the wake of the worst existential crisis in our economy and environment in a century -- is suboptimal, even when one party had a huge majority. Suboptimal is O.K. for ordinary times, but these are not ordinary times. We need to stop waiting for Superman and start building a superconsensus to do the superhard stuff we must do now. Pretty good is not even close to good enough today. And what would be better than "pretty good"? A more ambitious health care policy that conservatives blocked; a more ambitious stimulus that conservatives opposed; a comprehensive energy/climate package that conservatives killed; more crack downs on Wall Street that conservatives have vowed to fight; and an education reform agenda that the president has already launched. In other words, Friedman has effectively endorsed the entirety of President Obama's agenda, most of which has passed, can't pass, or has to be severely watered down because of unprecedented Senate obstructionism. But instead of calling for reforming the legislative process, or calling on Republicans to start playing a constructive role in policymaking, or calling on voters to elect more candidates who agree with the agenda the columnist espouses, Friedman says what we really need is an amorphous third party that will think the way he does. Sigh. To hear Friedman tell it, this mystery party is, in effect, needed to pass a bolder, more sweeping version of the Democratic agenda. Why not just elect more and better Democrats to make that possible? Friedman doesn't say. How would the Friedman Party overcome Republican obstructionism? He doesn't say. How would this third party make the kind of institutional changes that have stifled the process in recent years? Friedman doesn't say. Other than that, it's a fine idea. It just gets so tiresome when this crowd argues, for the umpteenth time, that a magical entity can emerge that will agree with Democrats but not really, establish a "consensus" among people with sincere disagreements, and govern successfully without all the messiness that comes with a massive democratic system. Friedman's heart is probably in the right place, but there's a more constructive use of his considerable media influence -- present good ideas, persuade the public of their merit, and call out those who stand in the way of effective policies. —Steve Benen 11:40 AM Permalink \| Trackbacks \| Comments (12)