To: Real Man who wrote (42218 ) 9/30/2011 12:00:22 PM From: carranza2 2 Recommendations Respond to of 71442 Agree, denial is so strong that no one - except joints like the IMF who want to double its bailout capacity to 1.4 trillion in anticipation of doom - wants to note that we are in a depression. I think the classic definition of it, negative growth for x amount of time, or whatever, is flawed. Unemployment is the key, and its rate is fudged. We have been at 15% or so for years, not that anyone uses U6 as the correct figure. The ones who know are scared merde -less. Stockman was excellent this a.m. on CNBC, I hope you saw him [I watch CNBC in the a.m. for the streaming data only]. His message is clear-headed and simple, unlike the typical spun-like-a-tornado BS we see. This is it, in a nutshell: From the fiscal standpoint, tax revenues do not pay for expenditures. Tax rates cannot be raised thanks to the GOP and entitlements cannot be cut thanks to the Dems. There is about a 5% or so gap between income and expenditures. He didn't say this, but I know it and I know you know it, too: this gap is going to increase as time goes by and demographics imposes its iron logic. From the monetary end, Stockman is of the opinion that it has gone utterly delusional in the last 15 or so years. Bernanke's and Greensputin's free flow of money and low interest rates cannot be maintained. Treasury yields will have to rise thanks to the fiscal insanity. The bond vigilantes will ride again. When they do, it will hit the fan. In other words, we have a lot of work to do to in order to avoid a catastrophe. IMO, thanks to the nature of the debate we are having and thanks to class distinctions, I doubt there is enough sense of what constitutes the collective good to avoid the catastrophe. And, now dammitalltohell, you are telling me that gold is going to get dumped? Aaargh, where do I go for some shelter?