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Politics : Evolution -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Greg or e who wrote (21820)	3/2/2012 8:13:42 AM
From: average joe	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 69300

Just Because God Loves to Kill Babies, Doesn't Give You Permission! Brother Harry Hardwick Preaching from the Holy Bible During last week’s adult Sunday school class for platinum tithers, we planned next month’s protest at abortion clinics in Des Moines. After class, one of our newer members approached me and said, “Brother Harry, I have scoured the Bible and haven’t found any passages outlawing abortion. So how do we know it’s wrong?” I immediately called the class back to order and rebuked this novice Christian in front of his peers. Only a weak Christian or backslider would question a doctrine accepted by True Christians® for many years. If your preacher says something is a sin, it’s a sin – no questions asked. However, recognizing that Pastor Deacon Fred has a tendency to publish some of my sermons on the church website, and knowing that the unsaved are regularly drawn by God to our site, I decided to present the Biblical case against abortion for you this morning. It is true that the Bible contains no verses prohibiting voluntary abortion. That, in and of itself, shows that it is a sin. The only references to abortion in the Bible are to coerced abortion as a punishment for nonbelievers, sinners and those who fail to recognize God’s chosen people. In Second Kings, we learn that Menahem, leader of the Israelites, smote all the people who refused to follow him “and all the women therein that were with child he ripped up” (2 Kings 15:16). Later, in Hosea, we learn that because the land of Samaria rejected God, “Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up” (Hosea 13:16). Hosea decided to carry out God’s vengeance on the people by killing the unborn babies carried by the heathen women. He promised to “slay even the beloved fruit of their womb” (Hosea 9:16). Since killing their unborn children is one of the many punishments the followers of God have inflicted on nonbelievers, it is obviously not an act any True Christians® may undertake for themselves by choice. Furthermore, humans have no business performing abortions because that is God’s role. After all, it was God who killed all the unborn children on the planet (other than those of Noah’s immediate family) when He drowned everyone with the Great Flood (Genesis 7:23). And it was God who inflicted abortion on all the pregnant women when he rained fire and brimstone on Sodom and Gomorrah, killing everyone who lived therein (Genesis 19:24-25). And it was God who killed the unborn babies during the countless plagues and pestilence he inflicted on the planet throughout history. Abortion is obviously an act God reserves for punishing those groups of people who rub him the wrong way. It is not an act to be performed at human whim. Finally, friends, there is absolutely no reason to opt for abortion when God allows us, and in some instances, orders us, to rid ourselves of troublesome children after they’re born. Wasn’t it God who said, “Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones” (Psalms 137:9)? Why insist on prenatal killing when the post-natal killing options are so widespread? The Bible authorizes us to kill just about any child who becomes burdensome. According to Deuteronomy, if a child is unruly and disobedient, we not only have the option of killing him, but it is mandatory that he be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 21:18-21). The same is true for a child who speaks to us with foul language (Exodus 21:17). Or a child who hits us (Exodus 21:15). The bottom line is that only coerced abortion is allowed in the Bible, not abortion on demand. And God, in his infinite compassion, provided us with the means of eliminating troublesome children once they are born and we know for sure they are unwanted. So tell your skeptical acquaintances to put away the coat hangers, once and for all, and let the child be born, but have stones and the Proverbial rod handy, just in case. landoverbaptist.org

To: Greg or e who wrote (21820)	3/2/2012 11:24:51 AM
From: Solon	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 69300

"You talk out of either side of your mouth" LOL! Hardly! There are two levels of rights I referred to--DUH. Those RIGHTS I consider subsumed by the laws of Nature and Human Interest are moral--and have been made legal by civilized parties in all times and places. Where they are dismissed it IS a moral breach, and the legal support and sanction of all moral breaches IS criminal and unscruplous. I must remember not to use double subjects with you. The straw seems unable to absorb the context. Ouch! "Don't conflate insults for reason" LOL! Your knee jerk admission of defeat through ad hominem does not assist the failure of your conditional premise...does it?? :-) "That's an idiotic response to a perfectly legitimate analogy." No. That is a rational response to an idiot. A barn is NOT analogous to a woman. And naredowells trespassing in a barn are NOT analogous to a woman's zygote. A woman does not burn down her body to get at her zygote. Dumbkins! When an idiot uses analogies it is because they are unable to support their arguments through true premises running to necessary and sufficient conclusions. You need to ask yourself why you drag up stupid analogies without understanding. Take some advice: Stick to your ad hominems as "arguments"!! "Human rights are not granted, they are endowed by our Creator as the American forefathers recognized long before the United Nations." Of course they are granted. Peruse the history of law and the stairway of civilization and you will understand. As I said, inasmuch as REASON reflects objective reality, fundamental rights have an objective moral basis in Human Interest and any legal abridgement is thus immoral and corrupt. "All you do is beg the question of the Humanity of the unborn" You are completely out to lunch. Get with the discussion. Zygotes have no RIGHTS. Rights derive from Human INTEREST and where property is involved the INTEREST is that of the owner or the trustee. This instance (where they have no likeihood of ever having any Interest in any values due to (perhaps) a missing brain at birth), makes the treatment of living humans a controversial and difficult ethical question . It does not, however, affect the clarity of the abortion polemic.