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Politics : Liberalism: Do You Agree We've Had Enough of It? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jorj X Mckie who wrote (151946)	1/24/2013 6:44:13 PM
From: Broken_Clock	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 224750

"Tide, you know i agree with you on nearly every post, but i have to disagree here. unions have been poison since their inception. they have NEVER made things better for the worker, only the leadership of the union. people always say they gave us 5 day work weeks and higher pay along with safer working conditions. absolutely none of that is true. henry ford is a good example. he gave his workers much higher pay and a shorter work week at least 2 decades before the unions came along. he didn't do it out of the kindness of his heart. he did it out of ambition (some people call it 'greed', i don't). he was losing his trained workers and he had to pay them better and treat them better in order to keep them. it was only free market capitalism that improved workers pay and working conditions. these days union workers get less pay when adjusted for inflation than henry ford was giving his workers before unions. unions hamstring production in a number of ways and less production always translates to lower wages, less jobs and worse working conditions. unions have NEVER been a good idea." Yes,he used Ford as a 'good example', to which i responded with a Forbes article which essentially nullified grusum's point. Of course, grusum decided he didn't want to include that article in the discussion. You'll have to ask him why. I say Ford isn't a good example of much to be admired at all. he ordered his henchmen to beat unarmed workers to force them back to work under his conditions. According to grusum, that is "free market capitalism". Ford was a psychotic anti-semite nazi sympathizer who used his factories in germany to operate with slave labor. Get a frigin' clue dude.

To: Jorj X Mckie who wrote (151946)	1/24/2013 7:24:18 PM
From: Sedohr Nod	2 Recommendations Respond to of 224750

You can see why a pro union (look at me, I make the exact same money as the most useless and laziest person in the plant....along with the added benefit of hating the institution that writes my checks....so why try any harder) would be a tad touchy over Henry Ford.......A man that believed productivity and efficiency was the key to prosperity and tried to foster positive traits in his employees. Couldn't be helped....one of those conditioned responses.