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Politics : Politics of Energy -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Thomas A Watson who wrote (41805)	8/6/2013 12:35:38 PM
From: Bilow	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 86355

Hi Thomas; Re: "... based upon nonsense equations that violate the 2nd law of thermodynamics"; Here's the definition of the 2nd law from wikipedia: The second law of thermodynamics states that the entropy of an isolated system never decreases, because isolated systems spontaneously evolve toward thermodynamic equilibrium—the state of maximum entropy. en.wikipedia.org My claim is that doubling CO2 eventually increases equilibrium temperatures about 1 degree C. You claim that this is in violation of the above law which says that entropy cannot go down. I believe you don't have the slightest idea how to calculate entropy. Okay, by how many joules is my claim in error? That is, how much did the entropy of the system decrease by in the process of "releasing CO2 and then eventually warming up". Show me the calculation. You don't have to be exact. You can use appropriate simplifications and approximations. Of course the global warming claim is that the heating is not instantaneous so you will have to assume a time frame. Let's go with a year. And if you prefer, you can do the calculation in BTUs or some other units. -- Carl P.S. Since the sun is the part of the system that provides the energy source, don't forget to include it's entropy, LOL. And an appropriate simplification is to assume that the system includes just the earth and sun and that the only energy moving around is sunlight going from the sun to the earth and infrared radiation going from the earth to outer space.

To: Thomas A Watson who wrote (41805)	8/6/2013 3:00:44 PM
From: Eric	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 86355

Two factors increase convection. One is tiny changes in dry air density. The other is that the extinction distance of any heat wave-lengths C02 is tuned too happen even closer to any warmer radiating surface. A smaller volume of air now absorbs the same energy. that smaller volume is warmer and thus rises more quickly. Dry air mass has nothing to do with convection in the atmosphere. Neither does CO2! The atmosphere is not totally dry! The lapse rate and heating effects and percent of humidity of the air parcel are the major drivers of convection (vertical mixing) in the atmosphere. I have been teaching Aviation Meteorology for almost thirty years and you clearly do not understand the principals of how atmosphere really works. (comments from an over thirty year FAA Certified Flight Instructor) Eric