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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: JohnM who wrote (240714)	12/29/2013 2:23:11 PM
From: bentway	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541084

"As for the outcome(s), I really have no idea. Far too many balls in the air to argue that catching only one or dropping only one determines the outcome. We are, however, passing a very major turning point in which some portion of the population is covered under the ACA and will resist giving it up. As that portion grows, the politics of all this are likely to change." Exactly! As more people denied insurance previously are cover, they are going to fight tooth and nail to keep it. The result will have Republicans looking like the scrooges they ARE, an image they don't want to project. It was no more pretty in Dicken's time: <<"Are there no prisons?" asked Scrooge. "Plenty of prisons," said the gentleman, laying down the pen again. "And the Union workhouses?" demanded Scrooge. "Are they still in operation?" "They are. Still," returned the gentleman, "I wish I could say they were not." "The Treadmill and the Poor Law are in full vigour, then?" said Scrooge. "Both very busy, sir." ":Oh! I was afraid, from what you said at first, that something had occurred to stop them in their useful course," said Scrooge. "I'm very glad to hear it." "Under the impression that they scarcely furnish Christian cheer of mind or body to the multitude," returned the gentleman, "a few of us are endeavouring to raise a fund to buy the Poor some meat and drink, and means of warmth. We choose this time, because it is a time, of all others, when Want is keenly felt, and Abundance rejoices. What shall I put you down for?" "Nothing!" Scrooge replied. "You wish to be anonymous?" "I wish to be left alone," said Scrooge. "Since you ask me what I wish, gentlemen, that is my answer. I don't make merry myself at Christmas and I can't afford to make idle people merry. I help to support the establishments I have mentioned: they cost enough: and those who are badly off must go there." "Many can't go there; and many would rather die." "If they would rather die," said Scrooge, "they had better do it, and decrease the surplus population." Seeing clearly that it would be useless to pursue their point, the gentlemen withdrew. Scrooge resumed his labours with an improved opinion of himself, and in a more facetious temper than was usual with him.>>

To: JohnM who wrote (240714)	12/30/2013 10:37:57 AM
From: Bread Upon The Water	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541084

My point is/was that the subsidization of Medicare et al was mandatory. The citizenry weren't given a choice to sign up for paying the taxes to support it--unlike the AFCA in which they can refuse to enroll if they determine it is not in their economic interests to do so. Whether the Medicare programs would have come about had the citizens been given the option of having the their withholding taxes not deducted we will never know. Whether the young would opt out of Medicare now if given the choice of not having the withholding withheld we will not know either. Those programs (Medicare etc.) are not an apple to apple comparison to the AFCA as the Medicare tax is the same percentage for everyone--- Unlike the AFCA which makes some people pay more (on a percentage basis) to subsidize the others. The young are not being told they must support the old and sick in the AFCA--I agree--but that is a sin of omission IMHO. The rate distribution and cap on premiums for the older AFCA participants is being subsidized by higher rates put on the young and healthy and affluent (non subsidized persona). A lot of them I think will figure that out. What they do with that information is the question to be answered--as you acknowledge.